? Newly diagnosed, need help after reading several forum posts

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by JennC, Feb 16, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Hi All,

    My 13 yo male cat Diago was recently diagnosed as a diabetic on February 1st. My vet prescribed Novolin-N, 2 units BID. I currently have 3 cats and free feed Science Diet hairball control since it has a high fiber amount. We had anal gland issues a few years ago so the vet recommended a high fiber food. In looking at the forum it appears free feeding is out (even though the vet mentioned it would still be o.k.). Also, I see wet food is much better due to carbs. I'm working to switch him to Fancy Feast Chicken Classics, however it is hit or miss if he eats. Today is the first day, he wouldn't eat at all and didn't eat much at all during the night. I didn't give the insulin injection based on reading this forum.

    When the vet diagnosed him with diabetes he also indicated a bladder infection and prescribed clavamox drops. He was peeing so many places which I'm hoping stops once he is regulated. Since using the antibiotics and attempting to switch him to wet food he has had diarrhea and it's not getting better. This is my first question, should I be calling the vet or should I wait until he is done with antibiotics and see if it clears. My thought is yes. Looking for others thoughts.

    Additionally, I know it mentions if they don't eat don't give the insulin due to potential hypoglycemia. I seen him come up the stairs at 11:30 AM licking his lips so he finally ate (dry food), but obviously no injection until the next time which is around 7 PM tonight. His appetite is quite decreased as well as urination and drinking. The vet said these are indications that the insulin is working but I'm worried. He has also been sleeping A LOT. All other indicators for his bloodwork were in normal range, no other issues.

    Yesterday when I got home from work I noticed he had thrown up in the basement after his morning wet food. The last pile of vomit appeared to have diluted blood, although not 100% sure. Honestly, I'm sure everyone will say he should see the vet and probably have an endoscopy but the cost alone is extreme.

    Please let me know if anyone has similar experience or recommendations on our next steps. Note, we're only doing chicken Fancy Feast because he's allergic to several other proteins. Thank you all in advance. Looking forward to helpful feedback.
     
  2. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2017
    Hi. The Science Diet Hairball Control dry food appears to be 30% carbs which is a LOT. Normally, you would want to keep the carbs below 10%... even lower is usually better.. since carbs impact blood glucose levels. Wet food is best for reasons beyond carb content: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...r-more-than-just-carbohydrate-content.175004/ If you have not seen it yet, there is a great cat food database that can help you look for wet foods. There is a link in my signature. The AAHA guidelines (link in my signature) recommend feeding four times a day, but they say free-feeding is fine if your cat is underweight.

    A lot of people here feed Fancy Feast, and it works great for them, but my girls had a few issues on it. I am not sure what proteins your baby is allergic to, but please note that the FF Classic Chicken Feast does not just contain chicken. It also has fish and 'meat by-products'. If allergies are a concern, you may want to find a food without ingredients like that.

    Has Diago taken Clavamox before? Willow starting vomiting a LOT when she was on it (pills). So, the next time she needed it, they also gave me Cerenia which made a huge difference. I think I would at least call the vet and tell him/her about the diarrhea (I have heard of cats having runny poop for a while when transitioning to wet food) and the vomit - especially if it had blood in it.
     
  3. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2017
    Oh, and I meant to add... it sounds like you are not home testing. If that is the case, I strongly recommend you start. That is really the only way to know what is going on with Diago's glucose levels so that you can keep him safe.
     
  4. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thanks so much for your reply. We aren't home testing yet, trying to find which glucometer is best to purchase. Was just looking for a thread to help in that area but haven't found one yet. He's taken clavamox previously and always vomits on the first dose but typically is okay after. Tomorrow is supposed to be his last dose and I'm hoping the peeing out of the litter box doesn't return.

    I'll take a look at the list you mentioned to see what other types of wet foods we can try. We've tried salmon and duck and he immediately throws that type of food up. I'm going to try and make sure he doesn't get anymore of the science diet after today, I couldn't find that carb percentage, thank you so much for sending it.
     
  5. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Also, I haven't found when we begin home testing when should/should I not give the insulin injection? Also, it sounds like people might alter the amount they give based on the glucose reading but I haven't found by how much, etc.
     
  6. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2017
    The nutrition info for the dry food is found here under Average Nutrient & Caloric Content

    You want to be careful about stopping this food without glucose monitoring. The change to a much lower carb food could lower his glucose, and if you do not know his levels, there is the risk of sending him too low with his current insulin dose. There are lots of threads here about home testing/monitors. If you have a specific monitor question that you cannot find the answer to, you could start a new thread asking that question, and I am sure people would jump in. I use the AlphaTrak pet monitor, but a lot of people here use people meters due to strips being cheaper. You want one that takes a very small blood sample.

    Normally, the starting 'no shot' number is 200 if you are using a people meter and more like 250 if you are using an AlphaTrak. As you gain more testing data, you will probably find that your no shot number can be adjusted to something lower. It is usually good to hold the same insulin dose for a while so that you can see how it works rather than changing doses all the time based on pre-shot tests. After being on the dose several cycles, and getting several test results.. and possibly even doing a curve.. you can see the impact of the dose and decide whether it needs to be adjusted. Small adjustments are usually best. Having said all of that, I also need to say that I am not at all familiar with the type of insulin you are using. I suggest you read this: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...e-to-novolin-humulin-nph.186097/#post-2066613 And, you may want to try posting your questions that are specific to that insulin on this forum: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/caninsulin-vetsulin-and-n-nph.19/
     
  7. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thank you so very much! I'm really glad I found this site.
     
  8. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    If you need more fiber in the diet I would do fancy feast and add a little canned pumpkin to it. You can feed any time just not two hours prior to the preshot test.


    I also use an Alphatrak, but a lot of folks here use a human meter such as Walmart brand Relion micro or confirm. I have a video in my signature showing how I test my cat CC at home.
     
  9. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    I think I tried pumpkin with him once and he threw it up but I might be thinking of a dog I used to have years ago. I'll give it another try. Thanks for the recommendation. Also, I'll be going tonight to pick up a glucometer. With him not eating this morning and me not giving insulin, I've been worried sick all day.
     
    JanetNJ likes this.
  10. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    Great you'll want

    1. Relion micro or confirm or some other meter that takes a 0.3 size sample
    2. 100 extra test strips
    3. Box of 100 26 or 28 gauge lancets as the ones that come with human meters are too thin
    4. Cotton cosmetic rounds
    5. Neosporin ointment with pain relief
     
    Stephanie & Quintus likes this.
  11. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Perfect, I've added it to the grocery list.
     
  12. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thanks all for your recommendations. We purchased a glucometer and his sugar last night with no food for over 2 hours was 405, he wouldn't eat so I couldn't give him his insulin. Of course he finally started eating a little of his dry food at 9 pm, so I was able to give him another dose of antibiotics. This morning woke up to vomit piles with a lot of blood. Took his glucose and it was 352. Took him to the vet, he is pretty dehydrated so the vet is keeping him for the weekend. The vet has no idea what going on, mentioned could be an ulcer, gastroentinitis, pancreatic cancer, esphoghas issues, no idea.
     
  13. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Of course at the vet and after some fluids he gobbled down almost 1/2 can of Hill W/D but threw it all up and it was green and slimy. Pictured is what I woke up to.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    If he's been vomiting a lot recently his esophagus and throat could be irritated and bleeding a little.
     
  15. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    He's gotten sick probably once a week if not less.
     
  16. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2017
    Poor Diago. You must be worried out of your mind. I hope the vet is able to figure out what it is and that there is a reasonable treatment option for you.
     
  17. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    I really am. I really don't think he just has diabetes, I hope I'm wrong but he's gone down hill quickly
     
  18. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    Sending prayers for you and Diago:bighug:
     
    JennC likes this.
  19. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thank you so much
     
  20. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    That's so scary. I'm glad he's spreading the weekend at the vet. I hope they figure out the best way to help him.
     
    JennC likes this.
  21. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Hoping for the the best for your kitty. :bighug:
     
    JennC likes this.
  22. Stephanie & Quintus

    Stephanie & Quintus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    Getting some tests in will make it easier to interpret the "not eating" and "vomiting" symptoms. Slight loss of appetite can indeed be due to lower BG, as the cells are starving less and sending less "eat eat eat!" signals to the cat. We'd also want to rule out the vomiting isn't due to sudden low numbers (but I don't think it's the case here).

    Has Diago had any blood work done? Was he tested for pancreatitis? It's more common than was once thought and comes with a variety of clinical presentations, is also difficult to diagnose -- there is a test called Spec fPL which is the best indicator we have for now. I'm asking because pancreatitis can bring on diabetes, as the pancreas is the organ secreting insulin. Sick pancreas = insulin factory not working well. (This is what happened to Quintus.) Common symptoms of pancreatitis can be loss of appetite, vomiting, abdominal pain. A cat with pancreatitis can seem on the brink of death. But they can also have pretty much no symptoms.

    If you have a moment you might want to set up a spreadsheet to write down your BG measurements in. The spreadsheet is designed so it can be shared with everyone and included in your signature. This will help people on the board help you. There is also a tab in the spreadsheet for lab results. Instructions: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ -- send me a private message (click on my name and choose "start conversation") if you need help with that.
     
  23. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thanks for your reply. He did have bloodwork on February 1st when he was diagnosed. He didn't have any other indicators out of normal range other than his glucose which was over 500 when they took it. I've only tested twice before he went to the vet on Saturday morning. Friday night it was 405 with no food for over 2 hours, and Saturday morning it was 352 with no food overnight. The vet did want to run bloodwork again but I declined until we complete the fluid and medication therapy for the weekend. Had I went forward this would have been right at $1,000 in less than two weeks for his diagnosis and now treatment. Thank you for sharing a spreadsheet, I'll ask the vet for a copy of his full panel and include it along with his readings.

    I will say when I took him on Saturday he noticed the blood on his ear from the lancet and was kind of surprised that I was testing, which makes me question how much he really knows about this disease. Adding to that, they fed Hill's prescription W/D wet food to Diago shortly after taking him in which is not so great as far as carbohydrates. They mentioned he ate about half of a can but immediately threw it all up and it appeared green and slimy. They actually weren't 100% sure if it was vomit or diarrhea and I explained his diarrhea has always been in the litter box.

    I was hoping to have heard from them today since I know they have to go in and check him, being a diabetic but no call.
     
    Stephanie & Quintus likes this.
  24. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2015
    Have they checked for ketones? If not, or if you're not sure, call the vet and ask/tell them to check for ketones right away. That is the most common cause of not eating in a diabetic cat.
     
    Stephanie & Quintus likes this.
  25. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    I don't think they have. I'll call first thing in the morning.
     
  26. Stephanie & Quintus

    Stephanie & Quintus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    You can also buy ketostix in a pharmacy and check by sticking a strip in his stream of pee if he'll let you. It's really important to check for ketones.
     
  27. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    I got an update from the vet. He did great over the weekend, no vomiting. I'm hoping this trend continues after he comes home. They did mention what he threw up on Saturday was really nasty but didn't see anything abnormal. He isn't sure what's causing the loss of appetite and vomiting, but for now he is eating his dry food. I should be able to pick him up this afternoon. :cat:
     
    Sharon14 likes this.
  28. Stephanie & Quintus

    Stephanie & Quintus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    Did they test for ketones?
     
  29. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    No, I asked them to test.
     
  30. Jen & Cosmo

    Jen & Cosmo Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2018
    Sending lots of prayers for you and Diego. Has a newbie myself. It a very overwhelming diagnosis. ((Hugs))
     
  31. JennC

    JennC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Thank you so much! It has been very overwhelming since the diagnosis.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page