princess

Hi there , first time user and just lost my first conversation i posted, so here i go again. 15 year old female cat diagnosed with diabetes 8 weeks ago. Like you say, just take a breath. First level was 350, started insulin at 7 units and controlled by the vet twice a day for a week. Then after moving from 7 to 6 then 5 unit over the next few weeks. She seemed pretty under control and now on 2 weekly controls. She eats only cheap wet food and expensive dry food. Eats small portions of wet food twice a day and grazes through the day with diabetic cooked mixed with others. Over the years she has had kidney and liver problems all rectified with diet and medication. She had a control and her level was also low in the 30s direct sweet cookies given Last thursday she had her first hypo attack at 3am, gave her glucose paste and sweet cookies, after a while all was ok. Next day had control in afternoon at vet and her levels were in the 30's. Vet suggested to stop with insulin and control again on monday. Monday morning was 166 without eating 12 hours and she now has 2 units, going back this afternoon for another test. i am feeling a little lost with all of this. anyway, just wanted to put my thoughts out there, thanks for listening

 

Welcome to FDMB. There are many wonderful people here who will be happy to help you and your kitty on this journey. It probably seems overwhelming at the moment but it does get easier.

7 units of insulin is a lot of insulin to start with. I am very relieved to see you have had it reduced to 2 units. You may need to reduce it further. It is not safe to have the numbers in the 30s. Do you have karo or honey readily available to give kitty?

A few questions if you don't mind answering.....it will be easier for people to help you.

• What type of insulin are you using?
• How much does your cat weigh?
• Are you home testing your cat's blood sugar levels? If not we highly recommend that you buy a blood glucose monitor and start to test. By doing this, you will be in control of the numbers and it will be far safer for your cat. People here will teach you how to test...it is not hard and it is cheaper than having it done at the vets all the time.
• We recommend you only feed wet low carbohydrate canned food. Most dry food is too high in carbohydrates. But don't change the food until you are home testing because withdrawing the dry food can drop the blood sugar level lower than it has been. Wait until you are home testing and ask for assistance here to do it safely.
• Can you tell us your name and the name of your kitty and the country you live in please?......this will help with telling you what and where to buy monitors, food etc.
• Here is a link to create a spreadsheet for your kitty. Once you are home testing you can record the results on the spreadsheet and people will be able to help you with the correct dose for your kitty.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...te-a-ss-and-link-it-in-your-signature.130337/

It is great you are wanting to help your kitty. We look forward to hearing from you again.
Bron

 

Hi there, firstly my name is sandra and I live in belgium. Princess is 15 hyears and weighs. 5.35kg. We took her off insuline over the weekend, and on monday her bgl was 34. So put her on 2 units. Tuesday morning she was 166 after mot eating. Today at 3pm she was 46 and vet took her off insuline and will control her again on monday. i get very confused. She is better off insuline than on. Seems very sluggish and sleepy. Vet seems to think her pancreas is producing insulin again and shots are not necessary. We had treated her some time ago with cortizone and vet thinks this may have upset the insulin levels. I have not been testing her each day, she is not an easy cat to work with. No excuse, but vet seems to think se is not a heavy diabetic. So we are insuline free for a few days and i have not seen any bad effects in her.

 

Insulin is caninsulin and i use a vetpen

 

Hello Sandra and Princess, and welcome to FDMB

Normal blood glucose numbers for a cat are approximately 50 - 130; but some cats naturally run a bit lower or higher than this. So, if Princess stays in this range then it's right that she doesn't need insulin.

I do encourage you to try to test Princess's blood glucose at home. It is quite easy to learn, and the vast majority of cats can be tested. Many come to look forward to tests if they are rewarded with treats each time.
In a nutshell, testing involves pricking the outer edge of the cat's ear to get a tiny blood droplet (this doesn't hurt the cat); transferring that droplet to a test strip in a glucose meter; waiting for the meter to count down and give the result; and rewarding the cat with a treat or a cuddle.
Here is the link to the FDMB compilation page of 'hometesting' info, tips and tricks, and example videos:
Hometesting Links and Tips

It is possible to build up to the idea of testing in small steps: You can start to get the kitty used to the idea of testing by just holding or massaging her ear for a second or two, and then giving her a treat.

Meanwhile you could consider monitoring Princess's pee to see if she is spilling glucose into her urine. If there is glucose present then it is highly likely she will need insulin. (If there is no glucose present then that doesn't necessarily mean that she doesn't need insulin, but it would mean that the glucose in her system is below the 'renal threshold')
You should be able to get test strips - Diastix/Ketodiastix from most pharmacies. Ketodiastix are particularly useful because they test for both ketones and glucose.
You only need a tiny amount of pee for a test. Crumpling plastic food wrap in the litter tray is a good way to catch a sample.

It is possible that Princess's blood glucose could drop if you remove the higher carb dry food. This is something that could be done while Princess is off insulin. But if she goes back onto insulin then, as Bron says above, we'd advise only removing the dry food if you are testing her blood glucose at home (and can reduce the insulin dose accordingly so as to reduce the risk of hypoglycemia).

Best wishes,

Eliz

 

Welcome to FDMB!
Does the vet pen dose any lower than 2 units? Have you taken apart to see if you might use a syringe to withdraw the insulin? If you can, you can use lower doses than 2 units.

 

Hi Sandra,
Thanks for all those answers!
Your vet could very well be correct and Princess could be producing her own insulin again. Sometimes when cortisone is given, the cat can get diabetes but recover quickly. That is good you are giving no insulin for a few days to see how she goes.
I would encourage you to test the blood sugars as well as Eliz said. It is not hard and we will help you.
As Eliz said also you could try taking away the dry food and this will probably make the numbers even better but only if Princess is not having any insulin. It is not safe to withdraw the dry unless you are home testing because of the risk of dropping too low. But it is safe if you are NOT giving insulin.
Please keep us informed how Princess is going.
Bron

 

Yes it is in half units, and the lowest is half

 

Today thursday, no insulin given last night. She is a totaly different cat even ventured outside. I have a lady coming over the next few days to monitor her blood and then back to the vet on monday for control. Am giving more wet food and a handful of cookies over the day. She is also taking Antirobe 25mg antibiotics for a mouth infection and diareah. Hoping that by monday we have a well adjusted cat!,

 

Antibiotics may cause diarrhea due to disrupting the good bacteria in the gut. It can be helpful to give some probiotics a few hours after the antibiotic to replace some of the killed off good bacteria. Forti Flora (from the vet or Amazon), or a teaspoon of plain yogurt with active cultures if not dairy sensitive can do this.

 

Princess has been off insulin since wednesday. She seems ok. Back to vet today and after a small meal her level was 136. Will test her again wednesday. Hoping that she will be ok, but will control her with caution. Hoping that the excessive peeing and drinking does not return!,

 

That is good news. Have you taken her off the dry food? You will have a much better chance of keeping her off the insulin if she is only having low carbohydrate canned wet food and NO dry food as it is too high in carbohydrates.
You will need to keep her on this type of diet always now, otherwise her blood sugars could go up again.
Let us know how she is going. Good luck

 

She is eating 2 times a a day wet food from the Lidl (bit like Aldi) it is the only wet food she will eat. Wont even look at whiskas, etc etc etc. I leave a small bowl of dry food . Purina DM diabetic and Royal Canin Duabetic dry food mixed with a little of her renal cookies for her kidneys. Didnt want to stopp direct the dry stuff, so just giving her less each day. Back tomorrow for last control then we are off on 1week holiday, and feeling very stressed about that. I have a cat nanny coming 2times a day, she also has a diabetic cat so she should be in good hands. I have noticed her front paws are a little funny, leaning back on the wrists. Will keep monitoring that also, Back paws are ok. And her weight has not changes also, stays at 5.3kg

 

Beon and sheba, I am an australian who lives in belgium. Where are you from, I see sydney. I lived in cronulla but raised in lugarno

 

Hi Sandra,
That is interesting you are an Australian living in Belgium. I know Cronulla and have a friend who lives there, but am not familiar with Lugarno although I know where it is.
Yes I live in Sydney up on the northern beaches.
Good luck with the cat nanny. You are lucky Princess is not on insulin...makes it so much easier. The cat nanny might be able to give you some ideas of good low carb wet food you could try.
Keep us posted how Princess goes. Good luck with it all.
Bron

 

Sandra

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Will certainly do that. Just back from vet, up to 174. One very stressed cat. Tried to get blood but was not possible, but she pee'd and we sent that off to get tested. i am on holidays next week. We have decided not to restart with insulin till I am back. High is better than low, and cant control her, that will be for our cat nanny. We will do blood again and will test for the "f" thing.. Cant remember what it is called, but she was too stressed to go any further. Was hoping for a better result, but that was not the case

 

Hi Sandra,
Sorry things have not turned out better but you will get back on track when you return from holiday.
One thing I think you should do if Princess is not going to get insulin while you are away is test her urine for ketones. Buy a bottle of Keto-Diastix by Bayer. They are strips to test the urine for glucose and ketones.
Can you ask your carer to test each day or every other day. The reason is because if a diabetic cat is not getting insulin there is a risk of developing ketones and this can lead to ketoacidosis which is a serious illness. It is just a matter of testing the urine with one of the sticks. If ketones are detected in the urine the carer should take Princess to the vet. Make sure Princess drinks and eats plenty. I don't want to worry you but you just should be aware that this can happen without insulin. Hopefully she will be fine for the week.

 

Bought the sticks yesterday, and the cat nanny has a diabetic cat herself. She will test her blood every day and if there are problems, straight off the vet she goes. Just waiting for her to do a pee!,

 

Fabulous! Looks like you are well organised and it is really good the cat nanny is a diabetic...
When Princess goes back on insulin, ask your vet if she can go onto lantus (glargine) or levemir insulin. They are much better insulins than caninsulin which was made for dogs I think. Lantus and levemir are long acting insulins and you will get much better results if Princess can use one of them.
I do not know what insulins you have in Belgium or what insulins you are able to use for cats. If you could find out and post here someone will be able to tell you the best ones to try and get.

 

Well we have bee off insulin for some weeks now. Eating well, not drinking or peeing excessively. Have tested her BG every 2 days. She has been 242, 128, 149, 138, 109 and today 92. Always around 11am and just after eating. Vet says if she is around 100 she is ok. Vet is now on holidays. What do you think

 

Sandra, you mentioned Princess' front wrists. Do they look like this?

 

Yes, but not always. She is Not on insulin now and I see it less. Paws are pretty normal

 

Shiloh's paws have been like that for years. Long before diabetic diagnosis.

 

What are the paws so, does she have pain

 

Those are her front paws, if that is what you are asking. She does not have pain.

 

Being 'down on the hocks' or wrists can be neurological, or possible related to an electrolyte imbalance. If it is something new, or has never been checked by a vet, ask.

 

BJ...looking at Shiloh's picture, it's not something new. It's been that way for years. Doesn't seem to cause her problems or pain. What kind of test can the vet do to check for an electrolyte imbalance?

 

They do blood work and look for potassium, calcium, magnesium, and phosphate levels, possibly others. If there were a problem with these, you'd likely know, but still worth asking the vet.
Could just be congenital malformation.

 

Thanks, BJ!

 

Hi Sandra,
Good to see you again.
Normal blood sugar levels are approx 50 to 130 so if the levels are above that she may need insulin. Some cats can be a bit higher or a bit lower than these levels and it is normal for them.
Are you feeding only wet canned food now. Any dry food at all will raise the blood sugar...best to ditch them!
I will ask @Elizabeth and Bertie what she thinks about this.
The thing is if you don't give any insulin and she needs it, it will put unnecessary stress on her pancreas.
See what others say.
Have you set up a SS for Princess?