Sam - Month 9

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by Djamila, Oct 25, 2017.

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  1. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Well, after a couple of months over in L/L, it looks like we have come full circle and are back on ProZinc. Definitely not how I thought this story would go.

    On a happy note, he had a yellow PS this morning. I never thought I would be happy about a yellow. In fact a couple of weeks ago, a 249 would have given me a heart attack. This morning it made me do a happy dance in the kitchen and give Sam an extra freeze-dried chicken treat.

    It's also making me wish I had grabbed a later-cycle test during the night. to figure out if it was a long cycle, or if he dipped somewhere in there. I'll be at work all day today, so may need to set alarms during the night.

    Hope everyone is well, and all the kitties find happy numbers and warm patches of sunshine today!
     
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  2. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Hurray for yellow!!! :):):)
     
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  3. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    With a lower than normal PS, I expected to see a rise by +3, but he's holding steady. Hooray! Gotta celebrate the little things. :)
     
  4. Noah & me (GA)

    Noah & me (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I'm happy too because;
    1 > You did a happy dance in the kitchen.
    2 > Sam got an extra freeze-dried chicken treat
    3 > Where else would you find a cat named Sam? (our Sam, abused, adopted, now happy)
    sam01.JPG
     
  5. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    SO excited for that yellow!!!
     
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  6. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    It even looks like the same sink! I love this! What an adorable little pile of fluff you have there. I'm so glad he adopted you, or you adopted him, or whatever way that works. :)
     
  7. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Super excited to see he held it all day too. I was half-expecting a red tonight. Now I don't want to get greedy, but I'm hoping the increase might actually get some kind of curve going. I'll be setting an alarm or two tonight. Ugh. Wish me luck.
     
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  8. Noah & me (GA)

    Noah & me (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Sam I am, Sam we are!
     
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  9. Beenie (GA)

    Beenie (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Sam, gotta give your mama bean
    dat-curve.jpg :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2017
    Reason for edit: typo
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  10. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I weep happy tears :). We have a blue :cool:. We have an 80 point drop. Hallelujah!

    Okay, I'm not really weeping. But I am really really happy to see him respond to an insulin! :woot:
     
  11. Beenie (GA)

    Beenie (GA) Well-Known Member

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    :woot:Yay!!! Return of the blue:cool:
     
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  12. Noah & me (GA)

    Noah & me (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Well, it is a cat and it is a shade of blue.
    blue_flag01.jpg
     
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  13. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Djamila! Blues overnight! :eek::smuggrin: It's worth the agony of setting alarms to interrupt your sleep. You must be over the moon!
     
  14. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    It is the calmest I've felt in two weeks. I don't tend to have much anxiety, but these numbers have had me all in knots lately. I'm so so so terrified of DKA, and having him this high has been awful. I know he's not out of the woods, but to see him drop 100 points in the last few days has been fantastic!

    But now for the sad news: He is most definitely having neuropathy already and is struggling to walk all the way down the hall without flopping over halfway. Does anyone know/remember what type of B vitamin is used for neuropathy? I need to get him something soon. These numbers are really taking a toll on him. @Yong?
     
  15. Noah & me (GA)

    Noah & me (GA) Well-Known Member

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  16. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Zobaline, 3 mg per day. It’s the methylcobalamin version of B12.
     
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  17. Beenie (GA)

    Beenie (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I use Zobaline. You can buy it on Amazon here. It can take weeks to months to see results. I've seen improvement in Beenie. Hope you can get him started on it soon and he gets some relief.

    Chin scrithces to Sam from me and Beenie :bighug:
     
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  18. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Djamila,

    My word !! I never ever thought this would happen to Sam. Hope things start going better for you and Sam. I must admit, I miss this site, it is very different than L & L site.

    Buddy Takes B 12 with folic from the vet, which I think is about the same thing as Zobaline. Buddy has had a lot of high numbers and no neuropathy.
     
  19. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Yes, this has been quite the unpleasant surprise. Teresa, it’s so good to see you again! Just make a thread over here! I’d love to hear more about how Buddy is doing these days!
     
  20. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Djamila, I will do that, I miss you, Yong, Rachel & Kris.
     
  21. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    By all means, post over here, Teresa. It's so easy to get lost in the crowd on the L&L forum.
     
  22. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    :woot::cool::woot::cool:!!!!! Those blues are AWESOME!!!!!

    Teresa, we miss you!!
     
  23. Caitlin M

    Caitlin M Well-Known Member

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    Yayyyy Djamila and Sam!!!!
     
  24. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oh bless his furry little heart. He's bouncing from the 170's last night. :banghead::( Never would have thought my blue/green kitty would have a high flat cycle just because he hit a 174. Baby steps....

    He gets to see the vet tomorrow afternoon for a check-up. So I don't even want to see his numbers for that cycle. I also don't want to see the numbers on the vet bill :rolleyes:. I might be doing an ostrich imitation tomorrow afternoon.
    upload_2017-10-26_13-10-36.jpeg
     
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  25. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Yes, baby steps, Djamila. I can tell you, as a parent of an Olympic level bouncer, you need a very large wardrobe of patience pants. ;)
     
  26. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, I would take Sam's high flats over Teasel/Chuck style bouncing any day!!! You and Steph are the zen champions!
     
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  27. Noah & me (GA)

    Noah & me (GA) Well-Known Member

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    We call him either Swiffer, the Mop or Sam. He doesn't really shed so now he's shaved. Another neighborhood abused stray that sat at our back door in the rain. Not my kind of cat but what could we do. He was afraid of everything and must have gotten smacked when he was playful, took months to teach him chasing string was okay. Now he travels well and observes his Kingdom from the kitchen counter. Not neutered or chipped, no tear ducts from over-breeding. :oops:
     
  28. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Hi Djamila,

    Do you know the name of the generic Lantus.
     
  29. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I believe it is called glargine. It looks like Buddy hit a green last night! It's been awhile since he's seen one of those!
     
  30. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Lantus, is glargine based, but there is another name. I did not know of a Lantus generic, but some one had mentioned it in a post on the Lantus site and I forgot to write it down. Buddy, needs a lot of insulin, so I thought if I could get the generic I might try it.
    Yes, he did, I was up until 4:45 A.M. with him and then I got up at 7:15 a.m. to take care of him. MEN
     
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  31. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Hi Teresa,

    I think it's called "basaglar". @Chris & China tried it earlier this year. She can give you info about it.
     
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  32. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Thank you, you are right.
     
  33. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    It's not really a generic, it's a bio-similar but yes, I used it on China earlier this year so we'd have some kind of idea how it compared to Lantus

    It worked pretty much exactly the same on China
     
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  34. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Thank you, for replying.
    If you don't mind my asking, did you get it from a pharmacy in the US or Canada.
     
  35. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    Well I actually got it from DCIN .....we had some donated but nobody had ever used it, so I offered to try it on China since she's so tightly regulated.....we'd be able to see any differences in the way it acted on her better than trying it on a cat that wasn't tightly regulated (some people thought I was totally crazy for trying anything different on a cat that was doing as well as China is, but it was the only way I could think of to find out how it was going to work on other kitties)

    I'd have no problem at all getting it from Canada (the same pharmacy we get our Lantus from).....they do offer Basaglar now and it's a little cheaper than Lantus http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...canadian-pharmacies.49608/page-2#post-1344374
     
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  36. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aug 1, 2015
    I'm wondering everyone's thoughts on pet-sitter doses? I have to leave Tuesday - Thursday to present at a conference a few hours from here and Sam and Atticus will have their usual pet sitter. She technically can test, but last time she left huge bruises on his ears and blood splatters on the walls :eek::confused::blackeye:, so honestly I'd rather she just shoot.

    I've been increasing his dose rather quickly this past week since his nadirs are still rather high, and since I still think there is a health issue keeping him elevated as opposed to just trying to get a new diagnosis under control. That being said, we reached 2u this morning, and I'd like to hold that for a bit and see how it does. Given the numbers we can see so far, does it seem likely that he could safely just stay at this dose with the pet sitter? In general the recommendation is to lower a bit if someone won't be testing, but considering he's still got such a big buffer between him and a hypo, and he's probably more at risk for ketones than hypo anyway right now, my thought is just to have her shoot 2u. What do y'all think?

    Oh, and since we don't actually have 2u data yet, let's assume for the sake of discussion that he stays above 150 at nadir through the next few cycles. :)
     
  37. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Jan 11, 2017
    Hi Djamila! Sorry I've been MIA again :oops: but Kris gave you the correct B12 for neuropathy. I think the 2.0U will be OK for the sitter to shoot for the reasons you stated. Nothing else is showing up for the change in Sam's numbers? :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  38. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Aug 25, 2013
    I'm with you guys on the 2 units. She CAN test as you say, so if she suspects something is amiss, she can try to grab a test. Since Sam is still in those higher than we prefer numbers, I think 2 is a good safe dose. :)
     
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  39. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    It's good to see you! I hope work is going well!

    So far nothing is showing up in any of the tests. The closest possibility so far is another dental since only three months after the last one, he already has a fair amount of visible tartar. The vet says it really doesn't look bad though, and the gums look fine. So I'm going to try to start brushing and see if we can slow that down a bit.

    So far ruled out: arthritis, anything in the blood work, no pain anywhere, hydration is good, lungs are clear, urinalysis is fine, no ketones, heart sounds good (though no echo run at this point). Still waiting on pancreatitis test (though no symptoms of that anyway) and the urine culture (the expensive one). After that we'll talk again and figure out what, if any, tests to run next. Cost becomes an issue when you're running more expensive tests without any symptoms to justify them. And yet I hate letting him run this high without trying to track down the cause.

    I kind of wonder if it might not be his teeth anyway, just because it's the most obvious and frequent cause of our kitties losing remission or getting pushed out of regulation. Although I hate to have him go under anesthesia again if that isn't the cause.

    He's still peeing, pooping, playing, and purring. Other than the excessive drinking, peeing, and floppy back legs, he still seems fine in every other way. So who knows?!?!

    For now I'll just keep working the insulin and hoping whatever it is shows up sooner rather than later. If nothing else, the switch in insulin did seem to bring him down quite a bit, so at least that has helped. As Rachel always said, the best insulin is the one that works for your cat, and apparently, this is the one he likes the most.
     
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  40. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Oh Djamila, I had no idea you went back to ProZinc and a short stint on Lev. When did the prozinc start. Looking at the SS, something changed around 10.14 when you started on Lev. I am sure you had him checked out by the vet and they did tests and checked his teeth. And I hope the Zobaline helps. Hang in there sweetie! :bighug:

    Oh, just saw in your notes that you had him seen by the vet. Wondering if the neuropathy is causing his numbers to be higher. I would imagine they have pain with it.
     
  41. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aug 1, 2015
    Yes, it's been a topsy-turvy few weeks around here. Something has definitely gone awry with Sam. I don't think the Lev was the problem, but trying to get him (and me) adjusted to that while his numbers were going crazy was just too much. I wanted to be able to adjust his insulin to try to stay on top of his numbers, and couldn't move fast enough with the L insulins. So we're back here at least until I can figure out what's causing his BG to climb like this. He does seem to do well on the Prozinc anyway since his numbers dropped about 100 points in the first few days, but we are still in the process of trying to figure out what's at the root of the problem.

    Thanks so much for checking in, and for the encouragement! Hopefully we'll get to the bottom of it at some point!

    ETA: Oh, and I fixed the spreadsheet to show the switch to Prozinc. I completely forgot to do that.
     
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  42. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Keeping good thoughts for you and Sam. Hope the switch gets thrown the other way to better numbers. How was his teeth upon the vet appointment?
     
  43. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aug 1, 2015
    He had a cleaning and two extractions (and x-rays) done in August. It had only been 9 months since the previous cleaning, and at that point (November) there had been no sign of further issues, so the resorptions progressed pretty quickly.

    So now we are three months from the August dental and the vet said he's already got more tartar build up than he would have expected, but he said the gums look good still and the extraction sites look good. He even pulled up the x-rays to look at them again and make sure he hadn't missed something in August. He told me to brush his teeth if I can get him to cooperate to try to keep it from getting any worse.

    My suspicion is that this is the issue. From what I've been reading, dental issues in cats hide under the gums, so until they become obvious, you can't see that there is anything wrong. So we may need to wait a bit longer to be able to confirm that this is the culprit. Can they do dental x-rays without putting the cat under anesthesia?

    @Chris & China recommended getting him to gnaw on a wing/neck/gizzard in lieu of brushing. I'd tried it in the past with no success, but am feeling some urgency to slow down the tartar buildup since i really can't afford to get him a cleaning every three months, and am starting to worry that he won't have any teeth left if he keeps going like this! I did get him to gnaw on part of a wing tonight by sprinkling it with Fortiflora. He stopped as soon as the FF was gone, but it's a start. :)
     
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  44. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    That was going to be my suggestion too!!

    Have you tried just giving him bigger "chunks" of meat?.....like if his raw diet is chicken, just giving him a bigger piece of plain old chicken to gnaw on?
     
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  45. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I did pull off some chunks from the wing, and he ate two of them, then just licked the third one. Then he chewed a little on the bone/meat piece but lost interest pretty quickly. It wasn't too long after his dinner though, so he might do better if he's a bit hungry when I put it out. Thanks for the little nudge to try it again. hopefully this will help!
     
  46. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    No, they need to be under anesthesia for the x-rays to be done unfortunately.
     
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