Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by rhiannon and shadow (GA), Apr 23, 2014.
Thanks again for this list! It's great!
Thank you so much for this list. FF classics are so high phos. Would it be a good idea to mix it with cooked chicken to bring down the phos?
Has anyone looked at the Sheba Pates? The ingredients list looks good, but I don't remember seeing them listed on Dr. Pearson's list.
Has anyone heard of PRIDE by Instinct canned food? It's grain free. We serve our cat cheshire's chicken recipe in savory gravy. He has been I diagnosed with diabetes but we haven't started him on insulin yet. His only symptoms are drinking more and peeing about 4-6 times/day. We are also giving him Origen whole prey diet dried food in small amounts with the wet. Please feel free to share any advice you might have for me. Thanks.
I just looked on their site. Pride is grain free but has lots of other carbs such as peas, carrots, spinach to name a few. I don't think it is low carb but you can contact them for that info. They will respond.
thank for all your work in posting the food levels-
was amazed to see the high phosphorus on my favorite FF fish and shrimp.
Thank you for this list!
Would anyone mind helping me figure out what the phosphorus numbers translate into, percentage-wise for Dry Matter Analysis? Also, for some of the Weruva cans I couldn't find either here or on Dr. Pierson's list whether they are referring to the "Weruva Grain-Free Canned Cat Food" or the "Weruva Truluxe Grain-Free Canned Cat Food?"
this list is updated .... the other list I have is older.
Wysong Epigen dry food is supposed to be zero carbs, like Young Again. Their emails to me says it has no carbs, and when I switched to it from Nature's Variety Instict whic is low in carbs (~7%) I noticed a huge difference in that over around a week I have cut insulin by at least 2/3
Thanks for this list.
I was wondering. . . when it comes to choosing a variety. . does it make much difference if its 3% or 5% or 8% etc?
Would it be better, for instance, to get something that is slightly higher, say 8%, that doesn't have fish, or doesn't have artificial colors, etc? I find that 9 lives has a lot of low carb varieties, but their ingredients seem very iffy to me.
and so many of the low carb Friskies contain fish, yet, everything I read says to avoid fish.
ALSO. . . do we need to worry about phosphorus if our kitties don't have a kidney problem?
I'm also super worried about salt, but there is no way to know about that. . it freaks me out to see salt listed in ingredients!!!
too much seafood isn't good ... especially for males...
it can contribute to blockages.
also mercury is present in most of the fish ( I've read all of the fish)
cat food is made with the fish that is left on the dock after it's been sorted . It isn't high quality enough for human consumption.
unfortunately, my cat eats more of it then I would like but I keep trying.
and I myself, try to not use the higher phosphorus ones as much.... although I struggle with getting my cat to eat
So if you find a lower phosphorus one and your cat will eat it willingly, that's the best choice.
The chart helps you see which ones are too high.
I wish I had one who would eat the same kind each day.
Mine eats mostly 8% ..... she seems to do better with a little carb.
Her numbers went lower when I quit trying to give her 2% all the time.
Thanks so much for the reply!
I think I'll have to make big visits to petSmart and stock up! Without my 2 year old or we'll be in there 'til closing time!
I don't mind if my cat doesn't want to pig out she needs to lose weight! Though of course I'll have to keep a tight eye on her.
DO you have calorie counts to go with this list? MY kitty has lost soooo much weight, that I am looking for higher calorie counts while we are attempting to regulate him. The other list I have is from 2012, and of course, the highest calorie count was Artemis Chicken and Artemis Turkey and Giblets. Looks like they no longer make this, and the formula they do have is lower in calories. THanks ANyone else know of higher calorie foods???
I believe this list is an abstract of the food chart at Cat Info which does have the calorie counts.
I think this depends on the cat. For Tink, anything over 4% seems to raise his BG. But once we're down to 4%, going lower doesn't seem to make any difference (ie. there was no difference when I fed Weruva 2% than when feeding Wellness 4% - though I only gave it a couple days). Some cats are more carb sensitive than others.
Thanks Jen! I think we may be seeing a difference. But Skunky's numbers are so freaking all over the charts it's hard to tell!
I think for her, it's more how much she eats than what. Maybe. . . . . :?
Oh yes... how much definitely plays a role. Could still be the carbs though - a large amount of, say, a 2% food is probably more carbs than a much smaller amount of a slightly higher carb food... but I dont know... math has never been my strong suit. It makes sense in my mind for it to work that way... but I can't guarantee it does. And I know what you mean about all over the place... Tink is SUPER unregulated right now (after spending 6 beautiful months off the juice!). VERY frustrating.
I do know that I can give Tink a slice of zucchini (which from what I can tell is extremely low carb, if any) without affecting his bg... but if I let him mow down on a big ol' chunk of it... he goes through the roof. Dont ask me how I know this. :lol: On the other hand... one or two pieces of dog kibble is enough to send him flying high. Dont ask how I know that either. ohmygod_smile My animals are out to get me, I swear! :shock:
Can those following this post (ie. those who "get" how to calculate carbs) please look at my post viewtopic.php?f=28&t=125979 ?
Trying to find a good HC option (for low bg) - but not sure what the info I got from Wellness actually MEANS. They provided "as fed" and "dry matter" carbs for all their foods (which some of you might like to have, and is included in my post) - but the numbers differ from our 8% list. For example, I feed the 3 flavors of Wellness that are shown at 4% on our list. But the numbers they gave for these foods dont match. I just CANNOT wrap my head around calculating carbs (math and I hate each other).
Looking for mc and hc options, and would LOVE input. Thanks!
Tanya's crf site has an updated food list and she has added carbs to it.
I'm not familiar with that site. Can you provide a link?
felinecrf.org. Here's their food list.
Thanks! I love that it has the date last updated for each food. I always worry about that. Cowboy Cookout for instance - that's a BIG change that consumers probably didn't know about until after-the-fact (if at all). NOT good for a FD kitty.
I wonder why the carb calculations are different than our 8% list? All of the Wellness varieties I feed (the 4% flavors) are shown as 5 & 6% on her list.
Hers are the most accurate. On Pierson's list you will see she arrives at her numbers a bit differently. Also that list is older. Helen's list was updated August 2014,
this is great. thank you so much
Just put together a huge shopping list to try some new foods! Was doing ALL FF and looks like that's not good for my kitty after all!! I've made a list of all 5% and under and 250 & under, not including Tuna!! We will start there and see how he does!! Thank you for the easy to read/understand list!! Tanya's prosperous numbers really confused me!! lol
Thank you for posting this.
Does anyone know if 9Lives Meaty Pate With Real Ocean Whitefish is the same as the Ocean Whitefish Dinner? The reason I ask is that I can no longer find the Dinner version and assumed (never good) and it was renamed to Meaty Pate (by 9Lives)... now I have concerns it may have a higher carb count... it has a wetter consistency... almost gravy like (but clearer).
Question for the following:
5% - Wellness Kitten 216
4% - Wellness chicken 219
4% - Wellness turkey 201
5% - Wellness turkey and salmon 299
4% - Wellness Beef and chicken 226
6% - Wellness chicken & herring 303
6% - Wellness beef & salmon 207
are those referring to the comeplete health Wellness line? I want to try this but want to make sure I am getting the right stuff
Wow, powerfully great list! Thank you.
Having had a CKF cat as well as a previous diabetic cat...I am always worried about the phosphorous content BUT...because of Morrigan's colitis and being a kibble addict, I'm stuck with the m/d kibble for now and trying to work with FortiFlora to even out GI issues so that I can try again on the canned foods as they do bring down the BG numbers for sure! Unfortunately...there is no "perfect food" out there that will be good for every situation. It's sad that pet food manufacturers aren't taking more of this into account????
So my boy Sonny is not likeing the FF pates or the Friskies pates (i stopped feeding the Purina DM savory selects because of the cost and i heard it wasnt good) Anyway, he ate the friskies and FF for a couple of weeks and now he is being really finicky. Has anyone heard anything about the FF "chunky" line?? Its on the low carb list and think it would be "meatier" than the pate. Thanks!
5% -fancy feast chunky chicken feast -637
7% - fancy feast chunky turkey feast -624
there is a place to click on the orange list.....that expands it so you can see all of it....
those two are on the list already.....
Yes thank you! Just wondering if anyone had luck with the chunky? How did their DM kitties do
it's worth a try....they're just as good as the pates...they just have tiny chunks in them (but it's still "mostly" pate)
I'm not understanding the list?? If we are to feed < 250 phosphorous why does the list have a high phos content?
This is mostly a list with a carb count of foods under 10%
i included the phosphorus amounts because so many foods are way too high, especially fancy feast.
If we are aware of the highest ones, we can at least rotate and give lower ones during the week too.
the list was my personal list for Shadow and then I went thru the master list and just took all the under 8% carbs so the list would be good
for everyone else.
Some people have a hard time deciphering the master list on catinfo.org
so i created a printable list from what we knew at the time.......
much easier to carry to the store than the master list....
They wouldn't be on the list. This food is newer.
I just got an email from them:
"The typical analysis for the Sheba Pate is: 13.7% protein, 6.9% fat, 0.14% fiber, 2.50% ash, 75.90% moisture on an as fed basis. I hope this information helps."
The link doesn't work for me. It states it can't be found.
Looks like Tanya's site may have been hacked
I am new on this site. Trying to manage my 15 yr old Calli with diet only. It has only been 9 days since diagnosis. I found this site on the second day. I am now feeding her all canned no more dry. She is doing so much better on these FF classics. I just wanted to thank you for this very informative canned food list with carb values. It is awesome to know there are so many good choices in reasonably priced canned foods. Being on a fixed income as I am, this helps tremendously. Calli's BG level has gone from 441 on diagnosis day to 238 as of this morning. She has had better readings than that, her lowest being 108. I am hoping diet only will do the trick as the cost of insulin and supplies I cannot afford at all. I certainly do not want to put her down just because she has diabetes. I see with diligence it can be controlled. Again, thanks for this great list and would appreciate any other tips or info you might have to help me and Calli cope with this new lifestyle we both are now in. I am Barb by the way.
Welcome Barb and Calli! I'm hopeful that you can manage the diabetes with diet only, the food really does make a huge difference!
When you have a little time, if you could add somethings to your signature, it'd help us with giving advice. Such as, where you're located, date of diagnosis, Callis age, food used, and type insulin, if used. This way if people don't see your original post, they know a little more about Calli and can make better suggestions.
The next thing would be to set up a spreadsheet, but being "electronically challenged", I'm going to have to let someone else chime in on that. Lol
Hi...I too am electronically challenged and have no idea how to set up a signature. I keep a daily journal now on Calli, her readings, litter box habits, water and food consumption and overall day. This is a whole new ballgame for both Calli and I and figuring out a routine has been a challenge. Our old normal routine will no longer work! I do have a question maybe you can answer because I see you have been a member here since last year. Since I am trying diet only first and no insulin, should I take her morning reading on BG before or after her morning feeding? It seems that her morning reading is higher than it is for the rest of that day. I have been testing morning, afternoon and late evening. Is a spreadsheet really necessary since I already keep a daily journal? Thanks for responding to my post. I need all the help I can get. It is all overwhelming. We are in Florida, she was diagnosed on Dec 21 2015, she is 15 and has always been a very healthy cat. I have always fed my cats Fancy Feast and Friskies, but they are all fans of the gravies and sauces which I see is the absolute wrong thing, so now I am just doing the low carb pates in the classics and adding a little water to mix it up and make it more like the gravies. I chose to try diet only because I am on a fixed income and cannot afford insulin treatment. It has only been 10 days since the diagnosis and she has gone from having a 441 reading at the vet on diagnosis day to now anywhere between 150 to 230. Within 3 days after diagnosis her BG dropped by more than half. The vet was happy when I called to let her know and feels better about going the diet only routine first. Here's hoping I can get it down to normal range. Thanks for any advice or helpful hints. I appreciate it. Happy New Year!
Have you ever experienced constipation issues with your cat? Would you know what I could give Calli to soften her stools without raising BG? She appears constipated today. Also, I did figure out how to do a signature!
Have any of you heard of Pure Balance brand cat food sold at Walmart? Wondering what the carb percentage and quality of food are like. I just went to Walmart to replenish my cat food supply and bought one can out of curiosity, but will not give it to her unless I know if it is decent.
Hi all and happy New Year to you and yours! It is a good news bad news this day, bad, but not super bad news first. Calli had been very constipated, and thanks to several of you, you told me what to try as did my own vet. I hesitated to take action because of fear it may make it worse and I also thought if there might be blockage I could seriosly harm her. I was going to wait until today to take her to the vet to be seen. Anyhow, long story short Calli became pretty sick yesterday morning so I had to call my vet's emergency number since it was Sunday. Well, hundreds of dollars later (which I really did not have) Calli is now on the road to recovery. She needed x-rays to determine no blockage and how much stool had backed up. She was in a lot of pain. What they did was give her a few shots, then two enemas. She had a lot of backed up stool so it took two to clean her out. The vet said to add pumpkin or Miralax to her diet. Thanks to you all who also recommended the same thing. We started with Miralax today in her food which she has eaten all of, thank goodness. So now for the GOOD news! Last night before bedtime her BG reading was 115 and this morning it was 145!! Hoping these great readings will continue and that we have turned the corner and can indeed manage her diabetes with diet only! I am so happy today even with the bad stuff we went through yesterday. I will continue to seek all the advice and feedback from all of you. Thanks again and wishing you all good health and happiness in the New Year for both you and your beloved furbabies!! Barb
The % is per serving, what is a serving size of FF ? I can't read the print on the can even with my glasses on .
forgive me If I missed a post while scrolling, but was there info on SHEBA pate's???
No, the Sheba foods aren't on the lists because the manufacturer refused to submit the information to Dr. Lisa when she was making up the charts, but the pate's are low carb and fine for our sugarcats
China gets a Sheba snack every once in awhile
this one is the updated
I see things that worry me here. Dr Pierson's list has Fancy Feast Tender flavors (which I find as Fancy Feast Classic "Tender Beef and Chicken", etc...), as low carb - 4, or 5 %. but Tanya's list, as I am looking at it, has these flavors listed up at 22% sometimes. Those have been a significant part of our feeding, because those "Tender" recipes were so loved by our kitties, but now I'm am wondering, once again, if feeding has been a problem.
IF there is a gravy associated with any food..... it is likely higher carb.
I am not familiar with that one.
purina has changed many of their formulas recently so we really need an update.
try putting an asterisk in your ss for when you feed.....
you can start tuning in as to whether numbers go up after eating and by how much.....
that will tell you more than anything.....
each cat is different. My girl did better on 8 and 9 %..... I found out from feeding her.
i also recommend seeing if they will eat the fancy feast chunky chicken or turkey....
that one has not changed in the last few years.....
Hi Shorty's person, the Tanya site has a different way of measuring.
Because their emphasis is on the phosphorous content of foods they are do doing a 'dry matter calculation' by weight. Dry matter calculations are the best way of comparing phos content.
But here (and on Dr Pierson's list) we are using a different method for comparing carbohydrate content. We are comparing the 'percentage of calories from carbohydrates'. So, the total calories are totted up, and then a calculation is done to work out what percentage of those calories comes from carbs. That is why the numbers you're seeing are so different.
(However, as Rhiannon says, we could really do with some updated figures to take account of any recent change in food formulations...)
Hoping this helps...
Hi @Elizabeth and Bertie
Do you know if anyone... here.. or elsewhere... is working on an updated listing/chart? Sure would be helpful.
Is this something that can be done by some of us here?
John and Derek[/QUOTE]
No, I don't, John...
Yes, it is, John....
If there were a few people willing to take this on (it would be a heck of a lot of work for just one person) it would be of HUGE benefit to the US members of this forum, of which there are many....
There were a couple of people that expressed an interest in helping out with an updated list (in another thread somewhere)... I'll see if I can find it.... Then maybe people can message each other and get a conversation going to see if it's a possibility...?
Edited to add: John, here's the thread I was thinking about, but in fact I think there's only one person in the list, @Connie & Max , who has volunteered to help (apologies if I've missed anyone.... )
New/updated cat food list?
I'll post on the main health forum and see if anyone else is willing to help out....
That would be great. I'd think the toughest part would be getting usable data from the food manufactures
John and Derek
Fancy Feast has changed their recipe on their "Classics" Tender Chicken Feast in the last month or two. It is no longer called "Tender". Recipe changed too. I compared the two cans to each other and there isn't a large change in the recipe, but it is different. I don't remember seeing any changes that alarmed me, but it's a change.
Are you talking about classic chicken or tender chicken? I have noticed slight change in Silvester' numbers recently, and have been thinking about the change in FF, but the label shows no change in ingredients.
Thank you thank you thank you! Now I have a place to start! Puss and I can do this!
I think Sharon14 might be involved with this. I know some are working on a new list.
?Chase and I are fairly new to this. For his entire life, he was a free feeder of dry food only. He never did like wet food. Until now... and it took me so many varieties and combinations to finally get him to the point he is at now. He is eating nothing but Purina DM, at the advice of his vet. He wouldn't even touch it at first, but with patience and persistence, I've finally gotten him completely crossed over to eating it exclusively. And I can tell the difference in his BG numbers. Here's my question, though.... can someone tell me what food would be comparable to the Purina DM pate... that isn't so expensive. I have realized that there is no way I can financially keep up with the Purina DM. He eats one can, twice per day. And here's the thing. This guy is more about the texture of his food, than he is about the flavor. I mean... flavor is important, but he will NOT eat anything chunky or shredded. In fact, I was having to run his food through a blender at first, but finally he is eating pate. I work 60 hours a week on the computer... and my eyes are so bad. Reading labels is painful to my eyes, and when doing comparisons like this... well... it's so very tough. That's why I'm reaching out to those of you, here, who might have suggestions for me. I am down to his last can of Purina DM and finally have some time to go to the store, so I thought I would see if anyone was around who might be able to help. Thank you, so much!
Funny... the Purina DM (prescription) can doesn't even mention carbs on it. Does anyone know why?
This lists may help you find a different brand that he likes and is more affordable look for the ones under 10% carbs
And at least with Babu and my other cats once they got used to the wet food they were more accessible to different flavors so good luck
I know I need to red0 this post....
some of these foods don't exist anymore.....
but the more important foods are still relevant so we continue to bump it up......
reminder that the first number is carbs.... the number at the end is phosphorus which ckd cats need under 250....and as close as you can get.
Separate names with a comma.