4/1 Hank AMPS- 81, +6.5- 79, PMPS -89

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10729 Yesterday's condo

After days of dullsville, a little (much) excitement last night. He'd been so flat. Then shot delayed a low PMPS but teenie trace dose. Very late before bed +2:10 get a 53. fed a little HC drizzle on LC...a little more still mixed in for food left overnight.

THEN i couldn't sleep for hours.

Woke up PAST SHOT TIME today. Was it not April Fool's Day, we probably would have skipped and started trial today.(green light been given) We are just late on top of late. shot drop/0+ trace dose close to another 20 min late on top of yesterday's 20.

Nearly all overnight food (which had HC drizzle mixed in) was gone. So AMPS number maybe had this factored, depending on when he finished it.

We prefer somewhere between boring and too much excitement.

TIRED TODAY. and way behind w/ much to do.

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

I wondered where you were! I figured Oh well why not, so Tess is on trial and she dropped after feeding w/ no Insulin.

C'mon Hank, no stickies is great! flip_cat

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Good to see ya', sorry you are so tired. This heading towards remission is one of the hardest times (for the bean) in the diabetes adventure. (((Hugs to you.)))

From now on we all will be on pins and needles to see when you decide to start Hank's OTJ trial.
Anytime now is fine! Totally up to you! (tapping foot in anticipation here! :lol: )

Flat is good, look they even sell them in stores!

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Hi-
We're pretty much there. We've had a few days to get mentally prepared. Know you didn't have that.
We just hadn't gotten any BIG SIGNS...everything just even and flat. Had been only 1 pt below 50 1 time, and only on this last shaved dose a few cycles.

Last night was a reminder of the roller coaster drama this can be. I was never even sure if he was even getting any really these last days, then throws me a low 50's at barely 2 hrs. in. So i guess at least last night he got some. ALL the above, plus a few days on this last dose step & to get used to the idea..I think we are ready. Advisors seem to think so even without any BIG SIGNALS. He's just sort of easing out, I guess. Am feeling hopeful though, that he is ready and can go it on his own.

Just not on April Fool's. Too JINXY. For sure by the weekend unless a curveball.
With us being so late and this (low for us) number, today would have been it otherwise.

See, you got to start on March 31!
But we're right behind you!!!!!!!!!!!

Yay to Tess....Go Girl!

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Yay know, lower numbers last night, late shot times, Hank seems to be telling ya somethin'...

Yay Ann! Great work start to your OTJ Tess.

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Hysterical CD- where'd you get that?

Yeah..today would have been IT...enough signs for me. I was done w/ the late night pins and needles stuff (no pun intended), i thought. Then came the adrenalin rush i couldn't sleep through.
Paying for it dearly today. Between hank & tess, I'm a zombie today. (and still a vampire I guess)

Can you believe that beast had me feeding HC on a trace? I suppose if I hadn't fed and did a +3 or 4...i would have seen THE telltale number. But who knows, with this flat cat....it could have still been 53 w/ HC drizzle on top!

Won't be long now, promise.

But we want greens,.nothing but greens....so paws crossed for that!

smooches to Big Mac

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

so just how much of a dose is 0+? anyway?

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

The question? mark being the only consistency.

it is either:
-A dose or it ISN'T
- Trace
- Drop
-+/- drop
- +/- 0
- 0+
- .1 (some days perhaps)
- Token
- BCS
- essence of Insulin (MJ)
- Insulin fumes (MJ)
-Invisible dose (CD)
- Fat 0
- skinny .1
- fat/skinny drop
- unshot
- UNSURE (mostly)
- Uncertain - (usually)
- INCONSISTENT (for sure) but not really, 'cause we are CONSISTENTLY uncertain

From here: / next steps:
wave it over him
whisper Lantus in his ear (CD)
cut the needle from syringe and pretend shoot (CD)


So we're cautious! No 28's ike Stu or 30 like Big Mac!!

Some people been doing these imaginary microsdoses much longer than us, that's for sure. Not my forte'... never mastered 'em. Maybe a sticky w/ techniques for this stage would be in order?

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

:lol: Love it! :lol:

Glad they let me skip it, so far anyway. .1 was hard enough.

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Damn Near Zero
Trace
Fumes
Essence
Sniff
Wave the insulin over the cat (didn't Ronnie do that with Luna?)
and didn't someone measure the number of molecules of insulin in a drop? :shock: (old FDMB board, IIRC)

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

MJ-
trace, fumes, and essence i got (giving you appropriate credit, MJ)
Damn near zero is a good one, and sniff

Wave the insulin over him is in NEXT STEPS: (see part 2/2nd paragraph) that's where we go from here.
I think I can still add 'Sniff' here also.


Hankie- this is where we are heading. I expect all greens, all the time. you listening Mr. P????

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

PS- i don't know about molecules...too scientific. But somewhere didn't i see that someone had some sort of micron-scale they weighed them on?


OHHhhhhhhhhhhhhh And let's not forget the bubble factor. How much room do they each take up? Those stubborn one's on the plunger especially. try factoring those in definatavely!


I must work, I must work now!

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

just stopped by to wish you GOOD LUCK whenever you decide to start an otj trial!
not all kitties drop below 50 when they go otj. although, i suspect you may have seen a number less than 50 last night had you not hc'd the 53 so early in the cycle.

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Jill- HI!!!

Thanks for visiting! You're the voice of experience...think we have enough signals? Libby said ya'll pow-wowed and thought it was a 'go', but I'd already shot by then last night
Some of this he may very well be doing on his own anyway. And yes, it's possible he may have gone below 50 last night if waiting longer. But it was nearly 2:am by then. Had I known I'd not be able to sleep and been up anyway, i could have waited. But fed him by then in preparation for bed at those numbers. Knowing him, had I waited and re-tested, it would have been a 49 or something like that anyway. He probably knows too low and he'd give me a heart attack. But then those also would take any lingering doubts away.
If you think he's ready, which seems to be consensus form those 'in the know'..then we are pretty much ready to give it a shot. (no pun intended)
What is it you see that tells you so? Just curious.

Thanks for checking on us....this stage is just as complicated as all the rest. We are so grateful ya'll are keeping an eye out & for the support.

I sure hope Alex is doing better....best healing thoughts to him.

So glad to 'see' you! .and thanks for the advance 'wishes'.

betty and hank

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

Jill- HI!!!

Thanks for visiting! You're the voice of experience...think we have enough signals? Libby said ya'll pow-wowed and thought it was a 'go', but I'd already shot by then last night
Some of this he may very well be doing on his own anyway. And yes, it's possible he may have gone below 50 last night if waiting longer. But it was nearly 2:am by then. Had I known I'd not be able to sleep and been up anyway, i could have waited. But fed him by then in preparation for bed at those numbers. Knowing him, had I waited and re-tested, it would have been a 49 or something like that anyway. Nothing blatant. He probably knows too low and he'd give me a heart attack. But then those also would take any lingering doubts away.
If you think he's ready, which seems to be consensus form those 'in the know'..then we are pretty much ready to give it a shot. (no pun intended)
What is it you see that tells you so? Just curious.

Thanks for checking on us....this stage is just as complicated as all the rest. We are so grateful ya'll are keeping an eye out & for the support.

So glad to 'see' you! .and thanks for the wishes in advance.

betty and hank

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

imo, hank is ready. his numbers on the tiniest dose of insulin tell the story. at this point, the insulin is like a pair of training wheels on a bike. time to take them off to see if hank can ride on his own! he may wobble little bit (lot's of kitties going otj do), so don't shoot if you see a higher number than you'd like to see. instead, feed him a snack/mini-meal and retest 3-4 hours later to see if he brought himself down. before thinking about restarting insulin, we would look for and see an upwards trend in the numbers. we don't like to make any decisions based on one number...

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81

= 6.5- 79 'bout the same. he's coasting.


But MOST importantly he seems to feel really good today. He was sleeping a bit much for my liking the last couple days...drank a little extra, had me wondering. Today...up here by me hangin', sitting at the top of steps looking out, awake alert and seemingly happy!

grabbed a mid-day spot...then he had a few bites. All is well around here.

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81, +6.5- 79

go Hank. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

This is about as flat as they come. That's a good thing. :smile:

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81, +6.5- 79

yeah, he seems to be getting Flat down. except last night...did you see what he threw at me after ya'll all went to bed?
guess he got some jus' fumes after all.
Had i known I'd not be able to sleep after all the commotion, i would have w/held the food longer and tested again & perhaps gotten an even lower number but we were off to bed.

Today he just LOOKS like he feels good. Flat isn't so bad. I want him to practice 'Flat' for our trial....that's what I am going to want to see....green and flat, green and flat, green and flat. Like a lawn...but no weeds.

come back by soon.always glad to have you!

 

Re: 4/1 Hank AMPS- 81, +6.5- 79

Lookin' good, Hank! Whatever you're doing, Betty, keep it up!

Ella & Stu (who likes weeds, maybe that's his problem!)

 

PMPS- 89

Highest number in 8 days & 2 doses ago. There was I time not long ago this number would make me panic and afraid to shoot and I'd run here for advice. But at the moment it seems high, ... 25 points higher than last night. I know we're still green & in the big scheme of things we're fine, but per the German's we're not even in normal range. He didn't eat alot today, could that run him higher?

Don't be doing any funny business, hankie. No jinxy...you think he's been reading?

betty

 

You want whacky? Donovan's PMBG was 135 (huh?!?) but now just got PM +3 = 70. Bizarre. It's not worth overanalyzing and freaking out over one number, unless of course it's >600 or <20....

 

I wouldn't worry about the German standard of 'normal'. I consider any BG below 100 as beautiful. A BG of 89 is one of BigMac's favorite numbers.

Hope you have a great day tomorrow, Betty. Try to get some rest. Maybe you can do a sleep test... wake up just enough to do a test, then fall back into bed. Post the number tomorrow.

MJ... well said! (And very glad Donovan zoomed right back to where he belongs. Looked like a food spikey.)

 

yeah...I'm sure you're right. Just utching it's way up there.

Also today, in another condo, i read something monique wrote about phasing out toward trial and it conflicted somewhat with what I've been getting and got me thinking. Then he creeps his way up. I'm too tired to go stir it up & quote ...but will tomorrow. I'm exhausted and have to go to bed now. Have lead lids and zonked out from being up last night.


ok, g'nite all


B&H

 

Ni ni Betty!

 

Look at Donovan's AMBGs during his Bazooka trial.... I had to keep telling myself, as long as he comes back down, it's good. His body is responding as it should. He had a few :shock: days. Were it to creep up and stay there through the cycle for a few days, *then* I'd start wondering.

 

Hi CD-

& G'nite.


(wanted to run this other thing by you...but am seriously fading...TB continued manana)



sleep tight!

I'm glad Big Mac likes the number

 

Hi Betty,

Thanks for inviting us to visit your condo. I'll paste here what I wrote....I do think Hank is ready, being that he is a really freshly diagnosed cat (Amy's Pedro is somewhat longer diabetic and has other health issues, as well as some of the others I've helped out are "problem kids" :lol: Some cats are just super easy, they come the front door and straight out the back. If the diabetes is caught and treated early there is often little damage to the pancreas and all it needs is a short R&R and a jump start (sometimes just the diet change alone is enough!) with an honor roll student like Hank it is ok to cut the lessons short and move on to the final exam. The OTJ trial is just that a trial, if for some reason during those 2 weeks the cat starts slipping into higher numbers we can call it off and give him a little more study time and start over after a few more weeks. We have had many cats that had to be "held back" or repeat the exam, but I think Hank is ready to challenge the exam (I'm pretty sure he will ace it) if not he can finish the class and take it over again at the "normal" time :mrgreen:

As for the "German" numbers, first of all an 89 is certainly within the normal range, typically a number between 50 and 100 is considered very good (non-diabetic) and for a diabetic numbers upto 120 are acceptable. It is also not a concern when on occasion a higher number is encountered (I'm sure if I were to check my own BG periodically I might have a odd number once in a while) those can be explained by many things (stress, recent food intake, sickness such as a cold or tummy ache, even simple meter differences) as long as the numbers don't continually climb higher and stay high over days then it's not a concern.

Another point is that when the German protocol was written most of us were using meters that measure BG in whole blood and report those values. The reference range for whole blood for humans is 60-110 mg/dl (since human meters tend to underestimate the BG in cats slightly it was determines that numbers measured as low as 50 could still be considered "normal") almost all meters available today are calibrated to give results in plasma-equivalent which has a reference range for humans of 70-120 mg/dl. All meters in the US are now plasma-equivalent (only 2 meters still available in Germany are whole blood calibrated) I have one of those (Bayer Contour) I also have 3 plasma equivelant meters which do report a little higher. Of course there also differences between individual meters and manufacturers.

I think any "green number" is absolutly perfect and shouldn't be a concern, numbers as high as 110 (considering meter error) are reasonable to consider normal as well. Higher numbers that still are below 150 are good to follow up on but also are not cause for alarm especially if they occur only periodically and and lower numbers are recorded as well. Numbers over 150 that persist or continue to rise over a few days without dropping below 120 again are indicative that the pancreas is struggleing and probably needs a little more support and an investigation into other possible factors which could be behind the increased BG (eg. forbidden foods, infection, dental problems, physical or emotional stress, meter or test strip malfunction....)

Other references to the "German method" are simply modified techniques that I or someone else has recommended or used to deal with indivdual circumstances with cats that don't follow the "rules" when doing it the "typical way". ECID reffers not only to "problem cases" which require alternative dosing or requirements, but also to "gifted students" like Hank which are ahead of the game.

Good luck!