High Glucose, 9 units on Vetsulin

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sammy's G-ma

Sammy's G-ma

Member
Hello. My cat is Sammy. He is a mix between a Tabby and a Siamese, which makes a beautiful grey striped tiger look. Sammy is 6 years old.

History

We started Sammy out on Vetsulin. He stabilized at 7 units. But unbeknownst to me he was showing the early warning signs of Pancreatitis. He stopped eating his wet food and was only licking away the gravy. This was going on for months.

At some point I decided to switch Sammy to a less expensive insulin. I switched him to Novelin, the long lasting type, N I think.

Sammy had a Pancreatitis attack and was hospitalized for three days while he got intravenous Novelin and Water. His Ketones were very high. His pancreas recovered fast while he was on intravenous Novelin R. They put him on Antibiotics and on Antacid's and something else to help with nausea. These were all short term prescriptions.

Sammy had lost weight and was about 9 pounds

We brought Sammy home on Novelin N at 3 units and took him back in about every 3 days to measure his insulin. They uped his dose one unit each visit because he was running between 300 to 500, normally in the 400's. When we got Sammy up to Novelin N 10 units, he still ran in about the 400's. But Sammy was gaining weight and got back to 10 pounds. I believe Sammy is best when he is at 11 pounds.

For food we feed him a measured amount of Science Diet WD

Last week we did a Glucose Curve. Sammy responded to the insulin within the first 30 mins with a dip but in a short time after that he spiked back up and stayed high.

Since we were not getting results on Novelin we switched back to Vetsulin. They had me start at 6 units. Now we are all the way back up to 9 units. Still Sammy is still running in the 400's. We are using the U-100 syringes so we do the 2.5 conversion in order to get the right dose amount.

Today we did a Frutosamine test, it was high and did not seem to give the vet any ideas on what to do next.

He is a indoor and outdoor cat. We ended up finding out he was sneaking the neighbors food at night, so we do not let him out at night. If Sammy is throwing up I would not know, he hides it from me.

The good thing is Sammy is not acting like he is starving any more. His water and urine are high, but not extreme. He is gaining weight, he has a good apatite and eats all his food eagerly. But the bad thing is he is not responding to insulin he runs in the mid 400's. I would love ideas from you on what you suggest we do next. I have a human glucose meter at home. I have tested his blood at home, mainly to see if he is high or low.

Thank you for your insights!!!
 
Last edited:
Hi Jeanine, welcome. Good that you have a meter and know how to test! To find out what's going and to keep Sammy safe, you should test him before you feed and give insulin and then try to get a test or two during his cycle. The Science Diet W/D is a very high carb food, and if you start testing as stated above, then you can gradually switch him to a lower carb food. This may bring his glucose down significantly, so you must be home testing before the switch. We recommend a wet food over a dry and there's no need for the expensive vet foods, plain old Fancy Feast Classic or Friskies pate will do. If you can start the testing and record the numbers in our spreadsheet that will make it easier for us and your vet to help you.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
If you need help setting it up let us know and we'll get someone to do it for you. Please keep asking questions
 
Last edited:
Welcome Jeanine and Sammy!
To add on to what Sharon said with home testing, we can help you figure out Sammy's better dose. I can also help set up the spreadsheet as Sharon mentioned;). It sounds like the Vet has been increasing in terms of whole units, something very common but not practical. We prefer to recommend increases made in 0.25U or 0.5U increments. :)

If you could also setup your Signature with some information in the instructions, it's super helpful: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/ Also, helps those of us with bad memories :smuggrin:

As a new member to the forum I will also leave you this link: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-treat-hypos-they-can-kill-print-this-out.15887/
 
Hello! Sorry I have not replied sooner. Thank you everyone for your information. I have had several demands on my time, but I just got a window in my life to try these new things with Sammy.

Today I put Sammy on Friskies wet food with a little of the old food mixed in. I moved his does down to 8 units because I strongly feel the 9 units is WAY to high!! I plan to move his dosage from here in small increments as suggested here and in other threads.

I am astonished at the immediate results this simple change has made!!! For the first time in over a month Sammy tested below 330!!! Four hours after feeding today Sammy was at 117 on my human tester. Which seemed low, Sammy was looking for food. I gave him as much canned Friskies as he wanted. Sammy tends to eat what he needs, not over eat. If he acts hungry and scrounges for food it is unusual, and I believe it is because he needs food.

All I did was change the food!! What the HECK with that Science Diet stuff!!???? Was that really the problem?? Because EVERY vet highly recommended it!! Frustrated at that. But glad for this forum and all of your expertise!! I was skeptical to take your food change suggestions.

I still need to set up a google docs. I know google docs quite well so I think I will be able to set it up. If I have questions I will let you know. The suggestion to put important information in my signature makes sense. I will look into that too.

I plan to check Sammy's levels several times today, and going forward.

I am glad to have this resource, and for your help and insights.
 
Last edited:
Jeanine said:
Hello! Sorry I have not replied sooner. Thank you everyone for your information. I have had several demands on my time, but I just got a window in my life to try these new things with Sammy.

Today I put Sammy on Friskies wet food with a little of the old food mixed in. I moved his does down to 8 units because I strongly feel the 9 units is WAY to high!! I plan to move his dosage from here in small increments as suggested here and in other threads.

I am astonished at the immediate results this simple change has made!!! For the first time in over a month Sammy tested below 330!!! Four hours after feeding today Sammy was at 117 on my human tester. Which seemed low, Sammy was looking for food. I gave him as much canned Friskies as he wanted. Sammy tends to eat what he needs, not over eat. If he acts hungry and scrounges for food it is unusual, and I believe it is because he needs food.

All I did was change the food!! What the HECK with that Science Diet stuff!!???? Was that really the problem?? Because EVERY vet highly recommended it!! Frustrated at that. But glad for this forum and all of your expertise!! I was skeptical to take your food change suggestions.

I still need to set up a google docs. I know google docs quite well so I think I will be able to set it up. If I have questions I will let you know. The suggestion to put important information in my signature makes sense. I will look into that too.

I plan to check Sammy's levels several times today, and going forward.

I am glad to have this resource, and for your help and insights.

Jeanine
Click to expand...
Good job testing and switching food....it makes a HUGE difference.

When you get A chance set up a signature as well. Click on your name in the upper right hand corner and choose signature. Add info such as your pets name, date of diagnosis, type of insulin, food, type of meter, and any other health concerns. Then hit save.
 
I was feeding Sammy 4 times a day on Science Diet WD. Two larger meals when I gave him his shot. He was on 2 to 2.5 cans of wet or 1 to 1.25 cup of dry on Science diet.

I am thinking I will have Sammy on 2 cans of Friskies a day. Feed him 1/2 a can 4 times a day. Now that I think about it, I did have one vet who had a diabetic cat, he suggested to NOT use Science Diet WD. This vet suggested Sammy eat several times a day, smaller meals, to avoid spikes in blood sugar.

Do you have suggestions on how much I feed Sammy and when?

Look! I have a signature and a spreadsheet. :) Thanks for the help.
 
He was down to 9lbs and constantly hungry when I started giving him .5 cans extra a day. He is now just over 10 again I believe. He should be about 11lbs. He runs thin in the Summer and chubby in the Winter.
 
*I'm not an expert* but I did some research for maintaining, gaining, losing weight on kitties. With what I've found, I take an average of a couple formulas. If you are interested, I calculated you want Sammy to eat around 191.7 calories per day, so divide that by how many meals you feed time. Dr. Pierson's Food chart has calories per can for most foods :)
 
Forgot to mention I calculated that based on a 10.5lb kitty, so if he needs to get closer to 11lbs, you can round up to 200 calories / day :) until he reaches goal weight. Then just go back to lower end to maintain :smuggrin:
 
Jeanine said:
Janet this helps, thanks. Sammy did ask for more food then the 3/4 can I planned to give him this morning, so I gave it to him.
Click to expand...
I noticed he got down to 89 last night at +4... While a safe number he still had two hours of drop time. Now that he's eating lower carb food you may need to reduce the dose a bit esp when the preshots are lower. You may want to do 7-7.5 when the preshots are under 450

I think you may see the numbers gradually come down over the next week.
 
I am feeling good about this process so far, feeling in more control. Thank you for looking at my spread sheet. I was thinking I would bring him down to 7.5 today, until I saw his high pre shot levels this morning. I will bring him down to 7.5 for his evening shot today. I think that is a good idea. I have been reading more on the forum about HYPO etc. When ever I took Sammy into the vet we tested his blood at 4+. So right now my goal is to have Sammy in the Blue range on the spread sheet at 4+. Does that sound about right?

Notes

5/27
11:45pm Sammy looked groggy, would not jump up on his table, His eyes looked droopy and his movements slow and kind of drunk. He had a low level of 89. I gave him two spoonfulls of food. He licked the gravy and looked better.

5/28
Sammy stayed in last night. Was high first thing with no food. Seems strange. I am going to keep him in at night for a while to establish a pattern. Maybe Sammy's snack from late last night, that he only licked the gravy off of was still in his bowl this morning? Maybe Sammy ate that before I tested him this morning? Sammy normally is not hungry when he is high, he normally regulates his own food intake. But today he seemed hungry, so I let him eat more. I have a lot of confidence in Sammy knowing what he needs.
 
Jeanine said:
I am feeling good about this process so far, feeling in more control. Thank you for looking at my spread sheet. I was thinking I would bring him down to 7.5 today, until I saw his high pre shot levels this morning. I will bring him down to 7.5 for his evening shot today. I think that is a good idea. I have been reading more on the forum about HYPO etc. When ever I took Sammy into the vet we tested his blood at 4+. So right now my goal is to have Sammy in the Blue range on the spread sheet at 4+. Does that sound about right?

Notes

5/27
11:45pm Sammy looked groggy, would not jump up on his table, His eyes looked droopy and his movements slow and kind of drunk. He had a low level of 89. I gave him two spoonfulls of food. He licked the gravy and looked better.

5/28
Sammy stayed in last night. Was high first thing with no food. Seems strange. I am going to keep him in at night for a while to establish a pattern. Maybe Sammy's snack from late last night, that he only licked the gravy off of was still in his bowl this morning? Maybe Sammy ate that before I tested him this morning? Sammy normally is not hungry when he is high, he normally regulates his own food intake. But today he seemed hungry, so I let him eat more. I have a lot of confidence in Sammy knowing what he needs.
Click to expand...
In response to your notes.... While 89 is not technically hypo, since it's so far from his norm of 500+ it felt low to him. Another reason to ease up a little on the dose. If you ever want a second (or third or fourth) opinion on a particular dose, just ask on here.
 
BTW, while some cats peek at +4 on vetsulin, many don't hit the lowest until 5 or six hours post shot. One day when you can, try catching a 4,5,6 test to see what is happening to see the nadir (lowest) point.
 
I just found this image that helps me understand better what Sammy's blood sugar should ideally look like. This helps these blood sugar levels make a lot more sense!!

I continued to give Sammy 8 Units because the #'s seemed high. Now that I understand the curve, the numbers do not seem as high. I will go down to 7.5 tomorrow.

http://www.vetsulin.com/vet/Cats_Monitoring_About.aspx

IdealBloodGlucose_cat_lg.gif
 
Last edited:
Jeanine said:
I just found this image that helps me understand better what Sammy's blood sugar should ideally look like. This helps these blood sugar levels make a lot more sense!!

I continued to give Sammy 8 Units because the #'s seemed high. Now that I understand the curve, the numbers do not seem as high. I will go down to 7.5 tomorrow.

http://www.vetsulin.com/vet/Cats_Monitoring_About.aspx

IdealBloodGlucose_cat_lg.gif
Click to expand...
If the preshot is over 450 do I'd do. 8, if under do 7.5
 
Jeanine, just curious about a couple things.
1. Are you testing for ketones?
2. Would you be willing to try a start-over? My understanding is you got to current dose, and previous ones, via whole unit increases? @JanetNJ and @MrWorfMen's Mom can maybe chime in on their thoughts on this as well.
I know I have not used Vetsulin or Novolin N and if it could work the same as Prozinc and Jeanine was up for it, go ahead and go back to 1.0U, hold for 3 cycles and increase by 0.25U at a time?

*I am not trying to give dosing advice* Just a thought I had, of course it is very possible Sammy needs the higher dose.
 
I think a good part of the reason for those high pre-shot numbers is the massive drops Sammy is getting on the 8u.
27May he dropped from 396 at +1 to 89 at +4, a difference of 307 points
28May he dropped from 601 at AMPS to 146 at +5, a difference of 455 points
then he dropped from 480 PMPS to 187 at + 4, a difference of 293 points​
These drops are more than 50% of the starting BG and a recipe for bouncing.

With a history of ketones I wouldn't recommend starting over from scratch but I think it would be prudent to back off the dose slowly and do so by at least 0.5u or even 1u given the large dose he is on. The recent diet change is likely impacting his need for insulin. Purely speculating, it's also possible Sammy has a low grade asymptomatic chronic pancreatitis which can contribute to the need for higher doses of insulin than expected or there could be another high dose condition involved but right now it's impossible to determine an ideal dose or whether either of those secondary possibilities have any merit when he is going up and down so dramatically.

Sammy has become accustomed to high BG levels and any substantial lowering of his BG is foreign to him now and makes his system panic and release hormones to raise his BG to even higher levels. The goal is to try to keep kitty in optimal numbers for as long as possible in each 12 hour cycle hopefully keeping the bouncing to a minimum. You can't force the issue with huge amounts of insulin but also don't want to give too little particularly when there is a history of ketones. Bouncing once in motion takes a few cycles to clear and if the dose is too high and it keeps getting raised based on high pre-shot numbers, it becomes a perpetual problem that is going to take some time to get past. Dosing should be based on both pre-shot levels and how low the dose is taking him. Right now the doses are taking him to safe but drastically lower levels so as long as he is high enough pre-shot to receive insulin, I'd pay more attention to how low he is going to determine how to proceed dose wise.

If Sammy were my guy, I'd back off to 7 or 7.5u for a period of 2 or 3 days no matter how high the pre-shots are and pay more attention to the amount of drop occurring mid cycle. When the bouncing clears, I'd expect the pre-shots to come down on their own. If he is still showing drastic drops after a few days on the lower dose, lower it again.
 
This is a lot of good info. I have a lot of things I am not sure about....

We diagnosed Sammy late. I believe he had mild diabetes for 2 to 3 years before we caught it. Sammy gets more thin in the summer when he is more active. We took him into the vet, concerned he was a little under weight. Because he is a big boned cat, the vet would not be as concerned with Sammy's weight. The vet would scratch his head, think everything looked good. At the next summers dip in weight we would be concerned again. It took an increase in symptoms for us to catch the issue.

Because Sammy was diagnosed late I think his pancreas and his ketons had been building up for a while. Sammy's recent hospitalization was able to flush them clean. The hospital recommended strongly Science Diet WD to avoid another pancreas attack. But that switch created what looks like was 1.5 months of severe deregulation. At every turn I expected I would need to take Sammy back in again for pancreas and ketons. Then I found this forum.

I think it is likely Sammy has a build up in pancreas and ketons issues now because of this severe dis-regulation he has been under this last 1.5 months. I think testing for Ketons is a good idea and will be the next thing I add to his care regiment.

I am impressed with the level of knowledge in this forum. I think the concerns about Sammy bouncing make sense! When I look at what a normal glucose curve looks like it looks like the highs and lows have a difference of about 200. Sammy, as noted above, has been running 300 to 450. So that does sound like a bounce.

Quite honestly I was excited to see ANY dip below 330 from Sammy with the food switch. When the vet recently did Sammy's glucose curve he only dipped for a short time.

I feel like 8 is too High. I am much more comfortable with 7 because that is the one place Sammy was regulated at in the past. We always moved in whole units. And this was after years of undiagnosed diabetes. Even 7 seemed high, I would much rather have Sammy on lower units like I see in the other charts here.

This is what I think I will do....

Learn to measure Ketones.

Drop Sammy by .5 units every 2-3 days as long as his lows are more then 250 below the highs.

Once I get below a 250 difference in lows and highs I will make a new plan.

Thanks for reading. Sorry so Long. LMK what you think.
 
Last edited:
Jeanine, glucose curves done at the vet are not reliable. Most cats get stressed out and that causes their BG to go up. In some cases, that elevation can be 100 points or more so vets are really not doing their clients & caregivers or themselves any favours basing dosing on in office readings. Insulin is a hormone not a drug like an antibiotic so every day is different for every cat and too many vets seem to ignore this fact.

I'd definitely start checking Sammy for ketones given his history. Anything over a trace is cause for some action and if trace shows up, checking more frequently will be required because ketones have already been present for awhile by the time they show up in the urine.

Bounces can take up to 6 cycles (3 days) to clear so holding a dose for that long is generally suggested so as to be sure that any bouncing has cleared before making dose changes. Some cats bounce very little, others bounce a lot and dramatically. The trick is to figure out what Sammy is up to, how he responds and go from there. Getting his cycles to smooth out a bit will help. This is a marathon not a sprint so patience is key.

Jeanine said:
Drop Sammy by .5 units every 2-3 days as long as his lows are more then 250 below the highs.
Click to expand...
I'd aim for drops no more than 50% of the pre-shot reading rather than setting a "hard" number of points but not below 90 or so mid cycle. That gives you a bit more wiggle room to deal with any impending low BG readings.

From one big gulper Mom to another (my girl was on 16u twice daily for awhile:eek:), decreasing doses can be a little more confusing than increasing so keep posting and we'll help you get Sammy back on the right track.
 
I am glad to find another "gulper". I think waiting 3 days is good. Thanks for the information about the 50% drops. Your spreadsheets are hopeful! I loved seeing how low you were able to get the insulin units!
 
The Bouncing range was bigger yesterday. And seems to have been bigger today.

Sammy disappeared into the basement for his nap, he did not come when I called, and resisted the kids trying to get him. They said he looked fine.

With a human tester, how do I know what is too low?

I have been giving Sammy a snack 1/2 way between his shot. I am thinking I will start giving Sammy a snack at +3 hours, before the dip, instead of at +6 hours has I have been doing. Moving up the snack might help his bouncing from high to low be less extreme?

LMK what you think.
 
Last edited:
Technically speaking any reading under 50 on a human meter is cause for action to bring BG up to safer levels. That said, when using an insulin like Vetsulin, we generally recommend 90 as the point at which to start intervening because drops can be sudden and dramatic so a little extra wiggle room makes the process easier and safer.

Giving Sammy a snack earlier in the cycle (between +2 and+3 roughly) may be the ticket to smoothing out the cycles and lessening the big drops. Feeding in the earlier part of the cycle rather than later often helps smooth out the cycle.

I'd be inclined to reduce his dose to 7u given that 53 he got yesterday at +6, particularly if you are unable to monitor him closely. It's better to have him running a bit high and getting used to slightly lower numbers than having his BG go that low because it just sets off more bouncing and could become an unsafe situation.
 
Tonight my daughter is graduating. All our family will be at the graduation. Our friends close by are out of town. No one is available to come in and give Sammy his shot, Our plan is to give Sammy 1/2 of his shot 2.5 hours early and the other 1/2 his shot when we get home, Which will be about 2.5 hours late. I hope this is a good plan..... Seems like the best option available to us.
 
Jeanine, I'd be inclined to just skip the shot for tonight if it's going to mess up your shot schedule to shoot 2.5 hours late. While you have some shot time flexibility with Vetsulin, shooting twice will create two nadirs. Neither may be low enough to cause a problem but it does muddy the waters and these furkids can sometimes surprise us. I'd want to try out a technique like that ahead of time to see how it works with Sammy when I could monitor. If you can swing it, I'm thinking just giving the shot on your return home and then shooting an hour or so earlier tomorrow morning assuming pre-shot number is safe,to gradually work your way back to your usual schedule. Or just skip the shot and start fresh tomorrow morning. Sammy will be fine and you will regain ground in short order.
 
I think skipping is the way to go tonight too. The insulin you're using works on the glucose that's there so it will be easy to get a handle on that again.

Ketones develop when there's not enough food for the insulin to work on, the body begins using it's fat stores which don't 'burn clean'. It can also be not enough insulin to use the food correctly. Either way, ketones are the result. Testing ketones isn't a big deal - just dip the little strip in fresh urine and compare against the colors on the bottle at 15 seconds. Ignore anything that develops after that 15 seconds, it's no longer accurate.

HUGS!
 
Thank you for this information. And so quickly!

The Vets have told me that if my shot is late to give 1/2 a shot.

What do I do when I get home tonight? Feed Sammy? And give him half a shot?

Is it dangerous to feed him without a shot?

I will not give him 1/2 a shot before I go tonight. I will check back in here after I get home to see what you suggest I do when I get home.

Thanks for the info.
 
You have choices and have to pick what works best for you.
1. Just skip the shot and get back on schedule tomorrow morning.
2. Shoot when you get home but this will mean shooting later tomorrow morning and then gradually over the next couple of days getting back to your original schedule by backing up shot times by 3o minutes to an hour as long as pre-shot tests permit. I wouldn't back up by more than an hour and only do a one hour adjustment per day so it will take you a couple of days to get back to your original schedule.
3. You could shoot 1/2 dose tonight when you get home and just be careful about pre-shot and cycle tomorrow due to the possibility of some carry over from the late shot tonight if you shoot on original schedule tomorrow (i.e 2.5 hours early).

The caveats to all of this is Sammy's history of ketones. I'd opt for option 2 or 3 rather than skipping for this reason. Have you checked him for ketones lately?
 
Was just peaking in to see how you and Sammy are doing. I see you chose option 2 above and that's great. Hope you enjoyed your daughter's graduation! Congrats to her BTW!

I see Sammy got down to 71 yesterday from a lower pre-shot of 426 but then he scurried right back up again. If he were my guy, I'd lower the insulin down to 6u and try that for a few cycles to see if that doesn't even him out somewhat. Looking back at how the dosing was upped in the beginning, I am even more convinced that Sammy needs less rather than more insulin and it's quite possible you skipped right over the best dose for him due to the vet upping doses by full units at a time.

It's nice to see a reading of 71 for a change and while that it a safe number it's low enough to warrant a bit of steering to ensure Sammy does not drop too low with Vetsulin. It also sets off more bouncing and that's what he looks like he's doing right now. The only way to break the cycle of bouncing is to ease his BG down gradually so his body can get re-acquainted with more normal BG levels without panicking and that means less insulin so his numbers don't get pushed as far down mid cycle. :)
 
Hello. Thank you for checking in!!
I planned to give him a 1/2 dose but my daughter misunderstood and gave him a full dose.... So we have been readjusting his dosage time.
Sammy's pattern seems changed by this schedule changed so it has me scratching my head. I am glad you have a suggestion.

So, maybe I will back it down by .5 units every 3 days?? Does this seem decent?
 
I don't think the timing worked against you at all (that is being two hours later with his shot the other night) and you are gradually working it back so that shouldn't be causing any particularly different numbers. It's up to you whether you reduce by 0.5u or 1u but the difference in readings between 7 and 7.5 has been negligible so I think you can safely take it down a whole unit and it might get those pre-shot numbers down a bit more. Both 7 and 7.5u have caused Sammy to dip to low normal numbers bordering on becoming unsafe from fairly high pre-shots and while I normally wouldn't suggest decreasing by a full unit, when the dose is that high to start with, a 1 unit change really isn't that large. Different story when kitty's normal dose is below 5 units. If per chance 6u proved to be too little, which I seriously doubt, you can always take him up by 0.5u again.

Just noticed he's gone down to 149 today at +6. That seems great but he's dropping so much (441 points which is almost a 75% drop) that it is just perpetuating bounces giving you those high pre-shot readings. He'll likely be high at pre-shot again tonight. Yesterday he dropped 83%. It would be easier on him and lessen the bouncing if you can get him to drop no more than 50% and keep his mid cycle numbers around 90 to low hundreds. To be honest, I am worried he is going to go too low one of these days unless you get the dose down. Better to have him getting slightly higher mid cycle numbers to be safe and that will lead to lower pre-shots and give him some time to get used to having lower numbers.
 
Ok, this makes sense. Thank you. I will go down to 6. I am concerned about the big differences and the lows too. Also since I have quite a busy life. I try to test him often, but even as often as I test him it does not seem often enough. So if I go down lower that will reduce the risks, I can see that.
 
Jeanine, lowering the dose will reduce the risks but monitoring when trying to get a bouncy kitty under control is key so until you find that right dose for Sammy, a little more caution is advised. If you're in for a busy day, test earlier in the cycle say between +2 and +3 and see what Sammy is up to. If need be, you can always feed him to slow him down if he seems to be dropping quickly. Those early readings can be very telling much of the time so testing early gives you a head start at warding off any potentially too low numbers. It's a good idea to make sure you have some high carb food, and karo or honey around too just to be safe. Do you have a hypo kit set up? Not that you'll need it but having one helps hold Murphy at bay! ;)
 
Can you help me understand what testing at 2+ and 3+ would help me see? How would it help me know how low he is going? Should it be at 2+ and 3+ that I see less difference in numbers from the preshot number? And if the difference is high then the low will be lower? Is that what I am looking for?
 
Jeanine, with Vetsulin, cats generally hit their nadir (lowest cycle reading) between +4 and +6 however nadirs can move and might be a bit earlier or later on any given day. Sammy appears to often have his around +4 so if you took a reading at +2 or +3, you will already be able to see the drop starting. Today, I am wondering what his reading would have been earlier and whether at that 149, he was at nadir or on his way back up. Getting that extra test in the morning while you are trying to get Sammy sorted out would be helpful to answer that question when he is now getting some considerably lower readings.

If he's already dropped 100 points or more by +2 or +3, chances are good he's going to drop considerably more. If his pre-shot was way up, then a drop of 100 points that early might not be an issue but if his pre-shot was lower, say around 300, a further drop of another 100 points until he reaches nadir, could potentially take him low enough to need monitoring and steering. Today he dropped over 400 points in 6 hours. The trick is to get some more tests in those early hours and keep testing around nadir to get a sense of how fast and how swiftly he really is dropping. The other thing to be aware of is that cats often go lower overnight than they do during the day. You've been getting some earlier cycle tests at night but he's had some low readings during the day that cause him to bounce and that probably explains why you have not seen much of a drop early at night. Every cat is different and the trick is to learn how your cat reacts.

It's a lot harder backing up the dose than it is to start low and work up slowly so a little more monitoring right now will help get Sammy on the right track ASAP while helping to avoid any scary situations. I'll keep an eye on Sammy's spreadsheet and you can holler anytime if you have questions or need help. We'll help you get your furry friend figured out! :)
 
Thank you for your support and information.

So should I be focusing my efforts on testing him most in the +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 hours?

I think if I understood the best hours to be testing I could stay more focused on what is the most important.
 
I have been testing about 6 times a day. To me this feels like a lot. But I understand what you are saying about me not getting enough information about Sammy's curve.

So. What if I try to test 8 times a day.
AMPS, PMPS
And 3 times, switching every other day between odds or evens in the hours of +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7, twice a day.

Would this give me/ you/ others the information that is needed?
 
Good grief, I am not suggesting you test that often day and night. I don't know about you but I need my beauty sleep :woot: (not that it's really helping) and I don't want you turning Sammy into a pin cushion. LOL!

I am suggesting adding in one additional day test randomly with that test being sometime in the earlier hours of the cycle unless he throws you a surprise of a large drop early on, in which case for that cycle a little more monitoring may be needed. You are already getting some earlier tests at night and sometimes into the wee hours. So if you test at +2 and +5 one day, then +3 and +6 the next, then +2 and +4. Randomly right now will give you enough data to figure out when he starts dropping and to see how much. The earlier test will also give you the ability to steer Sammy up a bit if he seems to be dropping quickly.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top