Caninsulin - 2IU - when to see any result?

[Dasha and Kabosu]

Hi everyone!

My cat is newly diagnosed and has been on Caninsulin for almost 2 weeks, with the last week being on 2IU twice a day.
I have not seen any improvement in his BG numbers yet. The website of Caninsulin says you should not increase the dose to more than 2IU in the first 2-3 weeks of treatment. Does this mean I can still the improvement even if there was nothing in the first 2 weeks?

I am worried about my cat having 20+ mmol/l despite receiving the injections.

When did you start seeing Caninsulin having effect on your cat's BG?

Thank you!

 

[Elizabeth and Bertie]

I have not seen any improvement in his BG numbers yet.

Hi, well done on the testing!
There is some improvement on a few of those days...

May I ask, what are you feeding your kitty at the moment?
Does your kitty have any other health issues? On any medication at the moment..?

Eliz

 

[Dasha and Kabosu]

May I ask, what are you feeding your kitty at the moment?

He was on dry Royal Canin Diabetic (the vet prescribed it, and I did not know it was actually high carb). He also ate Applaws in Jelly (this is very low-carb but it's not complete food), mostly as a reward for his injections/ear pricking.

I've just understood how to calculate % from carbs and bought some lower carb wet food in the supermarket, and also ordered a few better ones from zooplus.

Does your kitty have any other health issues? On any medication at the moment..?

His back legs do not have a good range of motion, as the vet said, so they suspected arthritis. He was also bloated and had diarrhoea, but that was likely because a neighbour was giving him milk. We were giving him antibiotics for the diarrhoea (before we learnt about milk) and anti-inflammatory for his legs, but stopped more than a week ago.

 

[Elizabeth and Bertie]

He was on dry Royal Canin Diabetic (the vet prescribed it, and I did not know it was actually high carb).

Aha, is he still eating the dry food? And if not, when did you stop feeding that...?

His back legs do not have a good range of motion, as the vet said, so they suspected arthritis.

If he's had high blood glucose levels for a while then he may have some diabetic neuropathy. This can cause a weakness in the legs. Sometimes cats will walk on their hocks instead of their toes. They may find it harder to run and jump. And their feet may slip on some floors. Are you seeing anything like this?

Eliz

 

[Dasha and Kabosu]

Aha, is he still eating the dry food? And if not, when did you stop feeding that...?

He does not like it anymore, but it is still here for him in case he gets hungry. I believe he ate a bit of it today at around 5AM.
He is a "neighbourhood cat", and we are not the only ones who feed him. We tried to make sure that most of the neighbours do not feed him putting a "do not feed" on his collar, and talking to many people. The problem is that they knew him for years and they can't just stop feeding him because we say so.
Besides us, there is one more neighbour who wants to feed him as well, so we shared the dry diabetic food with him. Kabosu probably have eaten more of that food there.
I will try to now switch him completely to wet low-carb food, and will see how it affects his BG numbers.

If he's had high blood glucose levels for a while then he may have some diabetic neuropathy. This can cause a weakness in the legs. Sometimes cats will walk on their hocks instead of their toes. They may find it harder to run and jump. And their feet may slip on some floors. Are you seeing anything like this?

I only noticed he was less active, would not hunt or play. He can still jump or run but is rather reluctant to do so. The vet touched his hips and said they did not stretch as much as they should, and she also did not like they way he moved them when walking.

 

[Elizabeth and Bertie]

Besides us, there is one more neighbour who wants to feed him as well, so we shared the dry diabetic food with him. Kabosu probably have eaten more of that food there.

The fact that he is eating different foods could easily account for what you're seeing with his blood glucose numbers (responding a bit to insulin on some days but not others).
A high carb dry meal can raise blood glucose for over 24 hours.
If the carb content of the diet is variable then there isn't going to be a consistent response from the insulin. Diet plays a huge part. ...As an example, when I switched my adopted girl's diet from high carb dry to low carb wet her insulin requirement immediately dropped by half (in her case from 4 units to 2, and she later went into remission).
A few lucky cats no longer need insulin at all as soon as high carb food is removed from the diet. Conversely, some cats are only still on insulin because they eat a high carb diet... This is how important diet is....

But I can see that you are in a challenging and difficult situation if his diet is not in your control. That is really going to limit what is possible in terms of controlling blood glucose.
Is it possible to explain to the people who are feeding him that he needs to eat just the low carb food that 'you' provide in order for him to get well and stay healthy?

Eliz

 

[Dasha and Kabosu]

The fact that he is eating different foods could easily account for what you're seeing with his blood glucose numbers (responding a bit to insulin on some days but not others).
A high carb dry meal can raise blood glucose for over 24 hours.
If the carb content of the diet is variable then there isn't going to be a consistent response from the insulin. Diet plays a huge part. ...As an example, when I switched my adopted girl's diet from high carb dry to low carb wet her insulin requirement immediately dropped by half (in her case from 4 units to 2, and she later went into remission).
A few lucky cats no longer need insulin at all as soon as high carb food is removed from the diet. Conversely, some cats are only still on insulin because they eat a high carb diet... This is how important diet is....

But I can see that you are in a challenging and difficult situation if his diet is not in your control. That is really going to limit what is possible in terms of controlling blood glucose.
Is it possible to explain to the people who are feeding him that he needs to eat just the low carb food that 'you' provide in order for him to get well and stay healthy?

Eliz

Thank you for the advice! I did not know the high carb meal raises blood glucose for so long!

I'm definitely working here on the neighbour management I am pretty sure I've blocked 90% of food sources already, and I'm hoping to get to 100% soon.
Today he's been on wet low-carb, but another problem: he is SO hungry! He ate a full pouch of Whiskas in jelly and was still crying for more. If I don't give him food, he just leaves and looks for food elsewhere. I'm also afraid that if he doesn't get fed by our neighbours, he may go to another area looking for other people to feed him, and that will be very dangerous. Sigh...

 

[Dasha and Kabosu]

He has diarrea today, after eating two pouches of wet whiskas. He asked to go outside and I went with him. He pooped three times, the second two just a few drops. Then he came back in and had to go out again twice, each time pooping multiple times. I walked him like a today. I'm not sure if it's due to the new food or something else.

 

[Elizabeth and Bertie]

He has diarrea today, after eating two pouches of wet whiskas.

Some kitties can be a bit sensitive to eating a new food. So in that case it can be helpful to introduce it gradually instead of all in one go. ...But it does sound like he has been used to quite a varied diet given his generous neighbours, so, it's hard to know if it is the new food or not... His body 'may' also be adapting to a wetter diet....

I'm also afraid that if he doesn't get fed by our neighbours, he may go to another area looking for other people to feed him, and that will be very dangerous. Sigh...

Newly diagnosed kitties, and those in high blood glucose levels, can get very hungry. Their bodies aren't as able to get the nutrients from the food they're eating, so they often need to eat more to compensate for this.

There's usually a couple of things going on with feline diabetes; insufficient insulin + insulin resistance.
It can sometimes be helpful to think of insulin as a sort of key that opens the doors to the body's cells to let the glucose in.
When the blood glucose has been high for a while the cells of the body can become damaged, and less responsive to the available insulin. So, even when we start injecting insulin the cells are less able to respond when insulin comes knocking at their doors. It can take a little while for the body to heal enough to behave more normally.

So, it's often necessary to feed more in this situation. But it is a balancing act. Feeding 'more' doesn't necessarily mean 'feeding kitty as much as he wants'. High blood glucose levels can also affect the appetite centres in the brain, and can trigger feelings of hunger even when the cat doesn't need food. And a cat who is overweight may actually need to lose weight, since obesity can also cause insulin resistance. The objective, therefore, is to feed enough to enable the kitty to maintain a healthy weight, and to keep them comfortable too (not feeling too hungry).
Feeding little and often can be helpful, rather than a couple of large meals. And some of us add extra water to our kitty's food to help them to feel more full. (Rather like I might eat soup when I'm on a diet - there's lots of water in with those calories. )

I'm definitely working here on the neighbour management

It sounds like you're doing a great job! It could become a community project, haha!
And Kabosu-san is one very lucky cat to have you caring for him. Well done, you.

 

[Dasha and Kabosu]

It sounds like you're doing a great job! It could become a community project, haha!
And Kabosu-san is one very lucky cat to have you caring for him. Well done, you.

Thank you so much for all the support!

Just an update: he's been on wet low-carb food only for five days. There is not much improvement yet, and yesterday he had 25.9mmol/l in the morning.
The vet prescribed an ultrasound, and depending on the results, we may switch to ProZinc.