Working with MPM to get numbers down

at +3 Opie is already at 121 and he will go down more. . will feed him a few greenies and hopefully slow it down a bit
 
at +5 Opie went down to 83, waited 20 minutes and he went up to 97, . think it best to wait and test one more time before going to sleep just to make sure that he is going up . . . sure makes me think that this is still too high of a dose
 
I’m checking in on Opie’s spreadsheet and see that you must be exhausted. He had a very good cycle, but I am really happy that you gave him the reduction last night.

Remind me what kind of medium carb food that you have on hand?

I know you said that he grazes on food. He really had dropped a lot by +3; it looks like he either needed to be gotten to eat by +2 or needed perhaps a teaspoon of medium carb wet food by that time.

Good job keeping him safe last night. He is responding well to the insulin. Remember that (under MPM) he drops to 50 or below he needs another reduction.
 
My question is if I need to give him extra MC food to keep the numbers up then doesn't it mean that the insulin dose is too high in the first place?

I thought about it a lot and realize that nights are so different from day because we don't feed him at night, or any of our cats for that matter. Food is put away for night. I have other foods that he might eat but I usually just rely on a greenie because he will eat that readily.
 
LovingOpie said:
My question is if I need to give him extra MC food to keep the numbers up then doesn't it mean that the insulin dose is too high in the first place?

I thought about it a lot and realize that nights are so different from day because we don't feed him at night, or any of our cats for that matter. Food is put away for night. I have other foods that he might eat but I usually just rely on a greenie because he will eat that readily.
Click to expand...
He needs food fed regularly at night just like in the daytime. This is when he seems to be dropping his lowest— at night. A lot of people use timed feeders to dispense small amounts of food at timed intervals during the night. I realize that this probably wouldn’t work for you because you have multiple cats, but somehow he needs to get a teaspoon or two of food at about +2 and possibly another one a little later. What hour in the cycle are you usually going to sleep?
 
LovingOpie said:
My question is if I need to give him extra MC food to keep the numbers up then doesn't it mean that the insulin dose is too high in the first place?
Click to expand...
Not necessarily. But first, my suggestion to feed (possibly) MC was based on the assumption that you were giving an LC snack and it just wasn’t enough to slow his steep drop (which sets up another bounce.)

So first, I would try giving just a teaspoon or two of low carb wet food at +2 and +3 to see if that helps the night time cycles.
 
We are starting tonight the same as yesterday with almost identical numbers. I will try to get more food in him as you suggested but that isn't always possible because he refuses it a lot of the time. I go to bed just after the +3 test.

As always, Thank you for your suggestions.
 
Have you tried baby food? I find Gerber Ham baby food to be irresistible to most cats.

Anyway, it’s not a perfect world, is it? We try.
 
Yes, almost identical numbers going into the night. Fed him more at +2, +3 and again 3/4 can FF when we tested at +6 and he was at 126. Hoping he will be fine now as he usually starts to go up about this time so going to bed.
 
This is very good. I looked at his spreadsheet earlier this morning and I thought that you did such a great job of feeding him and keeping him from dropping too quickly that I thought there would be no big bounce this morning! Well done!

Low carb was perfect. When you said FF, I assumed low carb (although certainly there are other kinds, right!)
 
Awesome! You put all the 2023 data on a new tab. Wonderful. I was just going to tag somebody to help out. But you did it all yourself. :-)
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Awesome! You put all the 2023 data on a new tab. Wonderful. I was just going to tag somebody to help out. But you did it all yourself. :)
Click to expand...

I can't take the credit, I asked Marje from the spreadsheet info page to help me out. We had a bit of trouble for awhile and I couldn't add data but now it is all working good again.
 
LovingOpie said:
I can't take the credit, I asked Marje from the spreadsheet info page to help me out. We had a bit of trouble for awhile and I couldn't add data but now it is all working good again.
Click to expand...
Yes. I remember Marje helping me with my spreadsheet back when I first joined.
 
What a huge disappointment to see his PMPS is 428. UGH! I really thought he was doing better. I tried to feed him more after the 72 but he didn't eat enough I guess and since that is normally his low time I didn't test again though I guess I should have.
 
LovingOpie said:
What a huge disappointment to see his PMPS is 428. UGH! I really thought he was doing better. I tried to feed him more after the 72 but he didn't eat enough I guess and since that is normally his low time I didn't test again though I guess I should have.
Click to expand...
I would have tested an hour after the 72 and fed a little FF. But it’s okay. The bounce was probably inevitable. Perhaps you will be able to get more rest tonight!
 
I did feed him but I thought maybe not enough, I just didn't test. I guess the bounce was to be expected, just very sad to see it. I still have to test so it is still not sleeping through the night which is short enough as it is. But it is for Opie so what more can I say. . . . anything for my little loves. I come last on the totem pole. . .
 
another huge drop from 428 to 168 in 3 hours. . . looks like I will have to watch closely again, but thanks for trying. . LOL
 
My thought is too much insulin but we shall see. . . . yes I fed him and decided to get up at +5 instead of +6. In that time he went up from 168 to 251. He is really bouncing all over the place isn't he? He is like a ping pong ball. . . .
 
LovingOpie said:
My thought is too much insulin but we shall see. . . . yes I fed him and decided to get up at +5 instead of +6. In that time he went up from 168 to 251. He is really bouncing all over the place isn't he? He is like a ping pong ball. . . .
Click to expand...
When exactly did you feed in the cycle? I looked in the comments last night and didn’t see (I didn’t want to ask you if you had already written it.)
 
He is staying high today. I have been feeding him LC wet. FF classic pate and sometimes a bit of Friskies pate. Last night not greenies.

your comments don't always show up in my email so sorry for not responding, having internet and computer issues, strange things all the time. . . like I can't always add data on my chart when I try
 
The pinks have been going down. I’m wondering if he will go down a little more tonight. It’s been very gradual during the day.
 
PMPS was 324 and now at +3 he dropped to 75 and I still have the whole night to have him drop more. Ugh. . . and I made sure I fed him every hour after the shot. I thought he would go yellow but I never expected this much this fast. Why is PM so different than AM?
 
It sounds like you are doing everything right. I see that recently he has gone green a few times in the a.m. cycle. But many cats tend to drop lower at night. I hope he will stay steady for you tonight.
 
Wow, what a cycle last night. He had a nice surf in green. It was beautiful. Are you okay? You just fed LC fancy feast, right? We always advise to feed small amounts so you can keep them eating and they won’t fill up — but sometimes they do anyway. Or did you wait and retest to see if he was staying steady on his own (also a good idea sometimes.)
 
Oh, I forgot… if you have more than one test in an hour, can you put it into the cell for that hour. For example, two tests in the cell for +4. The first one would just be the number taken at +4 but then say you tested at 4.5 hours. You would write the next number, for example if you got a 75 you would write in that same cell 75@4.5. After that you would have to manually color code the cell because the automatic color coding won’t work anymore. The tools to manually color code the cells are up at the top of the spreadsheet. There’s a box for the fill color (the background color) and a box for the text color (with the green and blue backgrounds the text should be white or it isn’t very visible— for the other colors it’s black.). I hope this makes sense.
 
I personally think the low 60 was pushing it a bit because if I wouldn't have done something to raise it he would most probably have gone under 50 and it would have been a reduction. All I did was prevent it and keep the higher dose which he might not need. I think we should consider going down.

I fed him a few tiny pieces of the prescription diet which may be HC food. 6 pieces the first time and 12 the next with a little FF.

I tried putting the numbers in one cell and read the page about it but couldn't get it to work. I may have to ask Marje.

Exhausted, 5 hours of sleep so many days just isn't enough.
 
well now he didn't budge after AMPS, actually went higher . . . have you considered what I said about a reduction?
 
LovingOpie said:
I fed him a few tiny pieces of the prescription diet which may be HC food. 6 pieces the first time and 12 the next with a little FF.
Click to expand...
LovingOpie said:
well now he didn't budge after AMPS, actually went higher . . .
Click to expand...
ECID, but, it's surprising what just a few tiny pieces of dry can do. The reason we don't do dry food for lower numbers is not because it's slower to impact the blood sugar numbers (it's not), but rather that it sticks around longer in their system, keeping numbers higher longer than than wet food would.
LovingOpie said:
have you considered what I said about a reduction?
Click to expand...
You could try the reduction so you're not chasing numbers as much as MPM can require - especially when it's in the middle of the night! Trying a reduction wouldn't be a bad thing - if you were following SLGS he'd have earned a reduction! If it doesn't work you can always increase again.

The protocols are guidelines to give you a place to start but can be tweaked to meet your individual needs. Following MPM you could change your reduction point from 50 to 60 or whatever other number you're comfortable with - the main thing is what works for you.

I didn't aim for the 50's with Jess (for a couple of different reasons) and the greens we were getting suited us just fine. :)
 
Shelley & Jess said:
ECID, but, it's surprising what just a few tiny pieces of dry can do. The reason we don't do dry food for lower numbers is not because it's slower to impact the blood sugar numbers (it's not), but rather that it sticks around longer in their system, keeping numbers higher longer than than wet food would.

You could try the reduction so you're not chasing numbers as much as MPM can require - especially when it's in the middle of the night! Trying a reduction wouldn't be a bad thing - if you were following SLGS he'd have earned a reduction! If it doesn't work you can always increase again.

The protocols are guidelines to give you a place to start but can be tweaked to meet your individual needs. Following MPM you could change your reduction point from 50 to 60 or whatever other number you're comfortable with - the main thing is what works for you.

I didn't aim for the 50's with Jess (for a couple of different reasons) and the greens we were getting suited us just fine. :)
Click to expand...


Thank you Shelley, I appreciate your comments. I am getting tired of low numbers in the middle of the night. As you say, I can always increase again if needed. Is it ever possible to find a dose that works and stick to it or is it always an up and down thing?

I notice that your chart is not updated, does this mean you lost your Jess?
 
You may want to consider a custom reduction point. I know that you wanted to do MPM, but I think this is wearing you out.
 
Shelley & Jess said:
Following MPM you could change your reduction point from 50 to 60 or whatever
Click to expand...
I think we had this discussion before but cats eating dry food aren’t supposed to be following MPM. Personally, I don’t care about a couple of kibble if it’s rarely given, but I was quoted chapter and verse last time I said this to someone else.
 
I would take the reduction and see how it goes. What do you think you would like your reduction point to be. You will need to write it into your signature. Say: Reductions at ## (whatever number you have decided.)
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I think we had this discussion before but cats eating dry food aren’t supposed to be following MPM. Personally, I don’t care about a couple of kibble if it’s rarely given, but I was quoted chapter and verse last time I said this to someone else.
Click to expand...

He is NOT on dry food. This was an emergency only situation and something I could get him to eat readily and happily.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top