? 02-09 Panzer PMPS 100/ 179@+4/155@+5/128@+6questions

https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...-1-25-91-2-68-4-78-5-76-6-76-7-puking.273789/

First of all we are having a crazy high wind storm & it was pouring down rain this morning. The power blinked once & my inside antenna for TV is not bringing local channels in very well, I don't have cable, but I do have internet & my daughter pays for Hulu & Netflix but if the power goes out the internet does, luckily my phone is straight talk so unless the Verizon towers go down I'm good with internet from my phone.

Panzer was at 63 @ AMPS this morning. He has been having really nice flat cycles, I thought for sure today might be the day that's he dropped under 50 or even 40 but that was not the case. He seems kind of on the edge of getting closer to one drop under 50 to get closer to a reduction. He was floating in the 50s on Feb 6th & has had good cycles but still seems to jump into the blues quite a bit. He has been on this dose for quite some time now since Jan 20th @PMPS. We are super close to starting a new pen, maybe that will be the push he needs.

Anyone who's been following Panzer's post knows that he's on doxycycline after his clean catch urine came back as high leukocytes 500+++ he still has 13 days & 1 cycle of doxycycline to finish. He's also on Cerenia 8mg a day & ondansetron 1/4 pill 2xs a day. I only have one Cerenia pill left so I will definitely be picking another box up tomorrow. I'm not necessarily using the Cerenia for puking although he has once. I'm hoping it's the piece to the puzzle of getting rid of his infection? He will be done with them before my surgery reschedule date of March 3rd.

Spook has been giving me a harder time eating here lately & Panzer has been as well starting today. He did not finish his PMPS feeding left about 3tsps even with fortiflora added. They both had mirataz put on there ears on 2-06. I try to refrain from using it very often as I think some of there lack of appetite could just them being picky. I have upped Spook from one 1/4 pill a day of ondansetron to 1/2 pill & today to 2 1/4 pills, he's eating better but I don't know if it's nausea related or him being picky. He's been meowing alot @AMPS while I'm testing Panzer & he's using the litter box & waiting for food. I thought he could possibly have a UTI but he's not doing te pain meow before peeing every time or going back & forth between boxes.

Me & my best friend were talking about Panzer getting UTIs & having an infection in general. She thought maybe it could have to do with the litter. I did change to a different litter shortly after moving here over a year ago, I've been using Arm & hammer Clump & seal complete odor sealing litter ultra oder blasters 99.9% dust free. She was thinking maybe the arm hammer (oder blasters) that he's breathing in could be contributing to him being sick? We used the cheap special kitty litter from Walmart for years before changing, it was so dusty, it was horrible.

If anyone has thoughts on my topics of discussion & lastly my question about the cat litter, I welcome your thoughts & or advice.
@Suzanne & Darcy @FrostD @tiffmaxee @Bandit's Mom @Bron and Sheba (GA) @carfurby (GA)

 

He's @179@+4 what the heck...did I jinx him he's done this before though drop 20 points or so & then in the greens @+6 PMPS feeding/bedtime

 

Could it be FLUTD and not UTI? FLUTD presents as similar symptoms to a UTI but does not respond to antibiotics because there is no infection. Episodes are triggered by stress. Glucosamine and chondroitin supplements are supposed to help with FLUTD because they strengthen the bladder wall or something like that. Cartrophen shots also help with FLUTD but I think they aren't available in the US - only in Canada and some other parts of the world.

 

I was just thinking the very same thing could it be FLUTD? About 30mins ago after I got done scooping the litter boxes. I sat & watched crying & praying as Panzer went from litter box to litter box attempting to pee & nothing. I was & still am freaking out because I've had a kitty that had to be emergency catherized twice because he couldn't pee. He came back in the room & peed in the litter box. I don't know what to do I have no money for the vet, I've maxed out 9 credit cards on vet bills, medicines, diabetic supplies. I'm 50yrs old I have no kind of retirement or savings of any kind, I feel like such a loser & a bad cat mom. My Mom & dad have both passed I have know one to turn to for help. I don't want to lose my baby but there is obviously something seriously wrong with him & I can't do anything about it

 

FLUTD is triggered by stress and it's possible that he is feeding off your stress/anxiety. How often is he getting these episodes? You might want to try a Feliway diffuser or a collar and see if that helps? As long as he is well hydrated and peeing, you need not worry about a block.

 

I've seen him do this one other time about a week ago,but he actually was laying in the cat box. I noticed today that he has been going to litter box more often but by the time I hear him in there & run in there to watch him he's already out of the box. I watched him earlier as he was struggling to poop but got a good amount out & peed as well! I've heard of & seen the feliway that your talking about but a collar? He doesn't drink water but gets 3 tablespoons of water in all of his feedings,the only time I see him drink water is when he gets in the high 200 & 300s.

 

He doesn't act dehydrated at all, no sticking his tounge out. He grooms,plays with Spook, gets the zoomies,purrs, eats decent most of the time. He doesn’t act sick at all, he sleeps with me, he wakes me up before AMPS by knocking everything of of my bed side table. He's an aunrey 11yr old playful loving happy cat.

 

Sharing the page from Dr. Lisa's website on Cystitis.
https://catinfo.org/feline-urinary-tract-diseases/#Cystitis

 

Thank you I read about cystitis & although he doesn't eat any dry food, he could still quite possibly have it. When he was first tested for a UTI this time around, there was blood in it, so they put him on doxycycline & again he's on it for the high leukocytes. So that's where I see the over use of antibiotics comes in to play...he hasn't peed anywhere besides the litter box but that doesn't mean he won't eventually. As for low phosphorus food, I have tried to get him & Spook to eat all weruva & no fancy feast. I had Panzer mostly eating some of the slide & serves that were low carb & low phosphorus but he has decided he doesn't like them. However tonight he ate some weruva BFF chicken checkmate mixed with the take a chance chicken duck turkey BFF. I don't know if he will continue to eat them though. Should I look into a phosphorus binder? As for the buprenorphine I've tried to get 3 different vets to give it to me & none of them would. I might be able to get my vet that I have now to do it but he would probably want a urinalysis culture done on him which he won't do without sedating Panzer because Panzer becomes a totally different cat at the vet. The sweet happy to test boy at home becomes an evil terror at the vet & I know he acts like that because he's scared of them & knows they are going to do something to him to hurt him. Plus I don't have any money for these procedures I don't know what to do? Do you think I should give the Purina urinary tract wet food that @Diane Tyler's Mom gives to Tyler? I'm pretty sure it's low in carbs & phosphorus?

 

Hi Christina First I would tag @Suzanne & Darcy to take a look at his recent blood work which I see you have it in your SS to see if she thinks you should start a binder
I would tag @Wendy&Neko also

The Purina Pro Plan Urinary Tract Health is low carb and low phosphorus
I feed Tyler the Beef and Chicken Entree pate
Carbs are around 4.80
Phosphorus is 1.44 dry matter

They also have Chicken Entree in Gravy which isn't pate it like tiny pieces of chicken like the size of a chicklet piece of gum lol remember them, they are like tiny tiny chunks
Carbs are 4.5
Phosphorus 0.78 dry matter

So he doesn't get bored I give him some Tiki Cat Succulent Chicken in Chicken Consume , they are shreds of chicken
Carbs 0.338
Phosphorus 0.93

I put about a teaspoon full on top of the Pro Plan , I cut the chicken shreds up because Tyler likes it that way lol

The pro plan chicken looks like this small chunks

 

If it is low carb and low phos and he will eat it, you could try it.

I don't suppose you can ask the vet who prescribed the doxycycline for a script? Without taking Panzer in.

Maybe you could try some cat calming diffuser or collar like Feliway (there might be other brands as well) and also glucosamine and chondroitin supplements as well? And I know this is easier said than done, but don't stress - he will sense it.

 

I thought Sheba was having constant UTIs but it turned out she had FLUTD.
She would go back and forth to the litter box sometimes doing a dribble for several hours.
She would also dribble without realising it as she was lying down when she was having one of there episodes.
She often had blood in the urine.
I did all the things that Bhooma suggested and was able control it to a certain extent. But stress definitely triggered it.
Once you have established that Panzer is actually able to pee I would give extra fluids. That is what the vet told me to do.

 

Thank you Diane

 

I will certainly try thank you

 

Where do I get the glucosamine & chondroitin supplements at?

 

Panzer refused 2 different kinds of fancy feast @ AMPS today. He ate weruva BFF which I'm almost out of. I will be going to petco after Panzers shot @PMPS this evening, before if I get this house cleaned quicker. I will also grab some of the kinds that Diane mentioned above. He can be very picky so it's important that I have a variety selection for him.

 

Hi Christina I picked this up at Petco and it hasn't raised his BG at all , just sprinkle it on the wet food , it tell you how many capsules to give going by weight, Pet smart has it also or you can get it online

 

Hey @Diane Tyler's Mom do you happen to know the carbs & phosphorus in the turkey & giblets urinary tract pate? Chewy has a variety pack with the other 2 flavors that Tyler eats & the Turkey & giblets. I went to petco & they had none 45min drive one way on a Friday with traffic...I was 15mins late for Panzer's shot. I left with 6 cans of weruva, ridiculous. I'm waiting for my phone to charge up & I'm going to check pets mart out.

 

He can pee when I went to bathroom after shot time, he went pee too LOL I actually heard him peeing, music to my ears when I saw him in the box doing that nothing was coming out no dribbles nothing, it was almost like he couldn't get comfortable. He didn't seem to be pushing to go either,just sitting there for 30 seconds then moving to another spot in the box & going back & forth between the two litter boxes,no blood that is seeable then just leaving the room & he came back 5mins later & finally peed. I do think Panzer has FLUTD it makes sense with him pretty much having constant UTIs. I'm not sure if he has cystitis but he could be heading in that direction. I'm getting ready to check out Amazon & chewy for Feliway plug ins & the consequin. I'm going to take @Bandit's Mom advice as well & hope this helps my baby too. Thank you for sharing your experience with Sheba with me. I'm sure she had a long special life with her momma

 

It's been a long busy day but I got some tests in during the am cycle. He seemed to stay pretty flat today. Spook wouldn't eat +3 AMPS snack, but right now since Panzer is on doxycycline they have there probiotic than with baby food right after snack so he got that in his tummy. I'm not going to offer him anything different if he skips it he skips it. It's basically a food bump for Panzer while I'm working anyways. He ate very well at lunch +7 AMPS they both ate well. Panzer had to have Fortiflora @PMPS feeding. I'm going to give them Purina Pro Plan Urinary chicken & beef at there bedtime feeding in about 30mins & see how it goes. I have it in my cart to get from chewy so I need to see if there picky butts will eat it before I order it LOL. I still have to check prices for the consequin & the Feliway...tomorrow is another day & I'm tired....of course he's sliding into the greens now. Mom It's bedtime, time for me to start dropping. I got to talk to doc (his vet) for a good 15mins today will talk about it tomorrow!

 

They both flat out refused it Panzer ate weruva & I'm about to chase Spook around with his weruva...cats

Edited:Spook ate the proplan. He had to sit in a different spot but he ate so that's all that matters!

 

Hi Christina , boy what a waste of time for you today,, the Turkey and Giblets happens to be 9% carbs and the phosphorus is 0.95 dry matter
@Chrispooky12

 

I'm glad you didn't place the order with Chewy for the pro plan since Panzer didn't like it, and who knows if Spook will eat it again . What did you do find one can today to see if they liked the beef and chicken? I guess he didn't like the first spot to eat it lol
These cats I tell you will drive you crazy!
@Chrispooky12

 

Oh wow well it looks like I will be returning that one & the beef & chicken. I'm still going to try the chunky chicken though.

 

I bought 2 cans of each flavor, I'm glad I didn't order it yet either!

 

Panzer decided he was not eating @ AMPS I tried 3 different FF pates one chunky & 1 weruva. He finally ate FF chicken in gravy MC but he wouldn't eat the 4 other kinds he's such a brat. Spook ate all of his first flavor I offered. I swear if it's not one it's the other. They are both getting Mirataz on there ears @+1 AMPS.

Edited: we also started a new Lantus solo star pen today.

 

Hopefully one of them will like the chicken one

 

Looks like the Mirataz is working so far (knock on wood) I haven't introduced anything new yet. There eating the familiar fancy feasts so far. I did order 3 flavors of weruva BFF & some cosiquin & a Feliway plug in. Panzer has been peeing normally so far today & when I scooped the box last night there was no signs of small pee clumps consistent with cystitis. Hopefully I can get them to start eating at least some weruva to get some of the high levels of phosphorus down. I don't know if we will ever get completely off of fancy feast, but I'm sure going to try.

 

The boys just ate Weruva BFF chicken & beef best buds for the first time @+6 PMPS bedtime feeding & they loved it! Hopefully it continues because I ordered a 12pk of it from chewy along with the other 2 kinds they eat occasionally.

 

Panzer refused to eat again this morning. I'm hoping it's just him being picky because I don't want to go back to daily Mirataz again. He refused his LC FF, offered him weruva nope, he ended up eating FF MC again. He's such a brat

 

Panzer refused to eat FF @+7 AMPS. He's eating weruva but I didn’t get to put his 1/4 tsp mirilax in it what the heck is his deal!!! I don't want to put miritaz on a second day in a row

 

Cartrophen is what they call it in Canada and Adequan is what they call it in the U.S. It's my understanding that they are the same injection. But I don't know if you could afford this Christina.

 

I would definitely try the Cosequin. It's worth a shot. I would get a Feliway Diffuser. Don't worry about the Feliway diffuser being bad for them (and you could consider a "calming collar" ... Thunder Ease uses a different pheremone than Feliway and I am trying it now and have diffusers all over the house. Thunder Ease make a lot of different calming products as a matter of fact. The Feliway diffusers (and the Thunder Ease diffusers) do not contain the Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs) that so many human scented things like Glade... etc.... not to mention essential oils that are toxic to cats (a lot of the oils, not all of them, but I don't really burn scented candles, use any scents around the house and very rarely any scented products at all.)

 

Okay I've got the Feliway plug in diffuser, I just haven't plugged it in yet. I will plug it in Friday when I get off of work so I can monitor both boys & how they react to it. As for a collar neither one of them have ever worn a collar. I swore of collars when my mom's dog hung herself years ago! It was very traumatic! He's been eating pretty good so far today. He wouldn't eat his AMPS FF so I gave him weruva. I'm going to try giving him weruva as much as possible. That's what he seems to like better right now anyways which is good. Of course Spook wants FF, he's been skipping the +2-+3 snack (Spook) they get there probiotic right after with baby food & he eats better @+7 AMPS so maybe he doesn't need a snack. As for the consequin, I just need to figure out the best time to put it on his food because he takes so much medicine right now. I'd also like to add D Mannose back into the mix.

 

Probably not but I will ask the vet about the adequan. Is it a continus injection? Like monthy?

 

Yes monthly

 

I understand about the collars. My cats do not wear collars. There are “break away” collars though that will break open if tugged on. There are other anti-anxiety things that you could try. I understand being worried about whether he would eat food with the Cosequin in it. He can be picky.

 

I currently am trying the Purina Calming Care packets that are little packets like Forti flora packets that you sprinkle on top of or mix into food. I really thought I was seeing a difference, but then it went out of stock for over a month. Now I will have to start over from scratch (since it’s supposed to take a few weeks to really see a difference.)

 

I will have to check it out, I've seen it on Amazon & chewy because I always have Fortiflora on hand sometimes that's the only way to get them to eat!

 

Is there a taste to the to the consequin? If there's no taste I can always sprinkle it on his food otherwise I will have to give it to him in baby food, we already go through about 10 jars of baby food a week, with probiotic daily & slippery elm bark every other day. On a good note Panzer ate all of his weurva & Spook ate all of his FF @ PMPS feeding. We do slippery elm with bark tonight so if there's no taste to the consequin? I can put it in his +6 PMPS bedtime meal,he gets Mirilax in that feeding the oppiste night of when we do slippery elm bark.

 

@Diane Tyler's Mom do you know if they have a taste to them? Panzer can & is being really picky with food right now, he is doing well with weruva BFF at the moment but if it has a taste to it, he will detect it & not eat the food. He is to smart for his own good

 

Tyler doesn't taste it at all, if he did he wouldn't eat his food. Next time I open up the capsule I'll taste it myself. I always add water to his wet food and mix up the cosequin really good.

 

Okay you taste it & let me know I put 3 tablespoons of water in both Panzer & Spooks food because they don't ever drink water. So that's how I make sure there getting water.

 

OK I will let you know

 

Not sure if last night was a bounce or what? I suppose he could have dropped lower in between +7 AMPS & PMPS yesterday on the 15th. Sucks because he had been in normal range for 10 or more cycles not green but under 120, with the exception of the day that refused everything but MC!

 

My daughter came over tonight & I had her watch every step I do when testing. I tested him & stressed the importance of being quick once she gets back to the table with the warm paper towel for his ear. She's really having a hard time getting blood, I had to get it. She is coming the next three nights to do it again. When she injected his insulin, she had it in the right spot & shot. I had her pet down to see if it was wet & it wasn't. We both smelled her hand & didn't smell anything, of course neither one of us has gotten our smell back completely from covid. I had to shoot some extra insulin I pulled into the syringe in the sink the other day & I could smell that 100%.

I know this post is getting long so I will start a new one tomorrow.

 

I'm assuming mr Panzer's numbers are higher than usual because of the MC I had to give him yesterday @+3 AMPS when he was @52 or he dropped under 50 & is bouncing.

 

Well Panzer has been mister 62 this evening, not complaining but I'm pretty sure he's dropped under 50 2xs while I was working but I don't have the evidence so we stick with 3.75 it's a very good dose for him at this point!