1/20 Blue AMBG 254

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Patty and Blue, Jan 20, 2021.

  1. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2020
    https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/1-19-blue-ambg-184.241726/

    Morning.

    I thought I had it figured out but no. He's 254 AMBG and I expected it to be
    lower this morning. So much for having a plan.
    I spoke with Dr. Johnson this morning and she wanted me to start him on
    .5 every 12 hours. I explained what happened on .25 and told her I wanted
    to maybe try a drop every 12 hours. She said whatever made me comfortable. :woot:
    Another thing, Blue's tumor is disappearing!!!

    Good news on Brat. She's eating, drinking and pooping. Dr. Johnson is going
    to run blood work this afternoon. She's still trying to determine the primary
    source. Kidneys, Liver or Infection? I'm thrilled she's doing so well and probably
    gets to come home tomorrow.
     
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  2. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Hi Patty,

    Really glad to read such positive updates about Brat and the Bluebird! It's very good to hear you sounding better too. :bighug:

    Quite right too! You know what you're at, Patty. :)


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  3. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Hi Patty so happy to hear that Blues tumor disappearing !
    Happy to hear that Brat is eating , drinking and pooping.
    Hope they can pin point what's going on with Brat.
    I hope she can come home tomorrow
    Have a good day Patty ♥:bighug::bighug:
     
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  4. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2020
    I just tested Blue and didn't give him any insulin. He is at +4 and BG 82. He started at
    254 this morning. I'm miffed.
     
  5. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Why miffed?


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  6. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Because I don't understand why he went down. How am I going to dose him?
     
  7. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    OIC!

    As I said yesterday, Patty, I've no experience of juggling steroids and insulin so what my following comment purely speculative. I wonder whether it might pan out that a once-a-day dose timed as best as possible to balance out the rise from the steroids might work? If that were to prove to be the case then I think very close monitoring would be needed while the dose was active. Tricky.


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  8. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Yes. It will be tricky.

    Better news...Blue is out of his “room”!!! He tipping things over and I love it.
     
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  9. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat:

    ((((Blue))))

    :D


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  10. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    He's at 112 +7
     
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  11. Butters & Lyla

    Butters & Lyla Well-Known Member

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    May 30, 2020
    So glad to hear a good update on Blue and Brat. Prayers that whatever it is that is going on with your little Brat is easily identified and can be resolved quickly!

    Who has been helping you figure out insulin for Blue? Marje? It will be interesting to see what she suggests? If you're around today, maybe get in some extra tests to see if you can do a curve on his numbers? Just a thought.:bighug:
     
  12. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2020
    Yes, Marje has been helping. I'll try to get more tests today. I'm just amazed at the range of BG numbers.
    I was warned but just didn't realize he'd have such huge drops without insulin.
     
  13. Butters & Lyla

    Butters & Lyla Well-Known Member

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    May 30, 2020
    I wonder if the drops are from the prednisolone slowly wearing off....? I assume but have no clue.
    It's hard to be prepared for that until you actually see it. Quite shocking. How long is he supposed to be on prednisolone for?
     
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  14. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    I think he'll always be on it. That's my thoughts anyway but I'm not sure. I give him the prednisone at his 3:30 feeding and yesterday's numbers are different than today's numbers. I thought that was strange.
     
  15. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    I think the prednisolone is successfully starting to fight the cancer. He will need t have it for life so we will need to see how it effects his bg. So glad you didn’t listen to your vet. The prednisolone won’t wear off. That’s why it can be given at any time in the day. I think you will need data to hopefully figure out how to work this to his advantage. I’ve never dealt with prednisolone, bg and cancer though.

    so happy to see the response to the lymphoma.
     
  16. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Me too Elise. It hasn't even been a week. He was so ill. I'll try to get a record of BG and see if we can get a good idea if his BG will settle into a pattern.
     
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  17. Bron and Sheba (GA)

    Bron and Sheba (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    So happy to hear the good updates on Blue and Brat! You must be very happy :):bighug:
     
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  18. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    I haven't tested Blue again but I meant too so will do that now. I've been on the phone
    with Dr. Johnson. Brat's kidney numbers are all normal!!! Her liver has improved
    dramatically. She said since she improved so fast that she doesn't think there was
    disease spreading but she thinks it's a toxin. I'm not sure but now I suspect it might
    be all the new cleaning wipes, sprays etc. to kill the virus. That's really the only
    thing I'm doing differently. What products do you guys use?
     
  19. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    His BG is up to 220 +10 and he got his prednisone +7
     
  20. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Not only happy but so relieved. I've been upset for days. I thought I was going to lose them both. :)
     
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  21. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    That’s wonderful news about Brat. I only use Clorox wipes where my cats don’t go and just wash my hands often. Hand sanitizer is toxic as well so better to either wash your hands with soap and water or make sure your hands are totally dry after using sanitizer before touching them.
     
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  22. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    This is wonderful news, Patty! :cat:

    ((((Brat))))

    :bighug:


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  23. Butters & Lyla

    Butters & Lyla Well-Known Member

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    May 30, 2020
    That's wonderful news!
    FWIW, I make my cleaning products myself from vinegar, lemons, castile soap, baking soda. I have one spray that i make from hydrogen peroxide, which is on the CDC list as a virus killer...or was last I checked. You just have to keep it in a dark bottle. I make hand sanitizer from 85% alcohol (plenty high enough percentage to kill the virus per CDC when I checked) and tea tree oil but i only ever use it when I'm out at the market. At home I just wash my hands with soap and water...a lot. lol. Fun times. I'm super careful about what I use around Butters.
     
  24. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Hi Patty,

    Just a thought: maybe ask your vet whether there are any supplements for liver support that might help Brat going forward (e.g. milk thistle)?


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  25. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Thanks for all the great tips. I really do think the constant counter cleaning might be the culprit. I'll look into
    making some or finding a good source for pet friendly.
    I will definitely ask about a supplement for Brat. I'm leaving in 25 minutes. YAY I'm so excited.
    Blue is doing great. He came out of his room again last night and marched on me. I am blessed.
     
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  26. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    I have been longing for the time when you'd post with this very news!!! :cat:

    ((((Patty and her Bluebird))))

    :bighug:

    Now go get your tiny wee girl - and keep safe while you're out and about. :)


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  27. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    For your vetty bean: >>>> :bighug: :bighug: :bighug:

    (((Brat)))


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  28. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    YAY YAY YAY little Brat is home and she looks so much better. She has 4 meds to take. I now have 4 cats on
    multiple medicines. I ordered some small plastic containers to organize for each. It's a hospital!!!
     
  29. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Woot!!!!!!! :woot:

    Delighted the wee one's looking and feeling better - and back home with you!!! :cat: Don't know who I'm happier for, you or her! :D

    (((Brat)))


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    Last edited: Jan 21, 2021
    Reason for edit: Punctuation.
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  30. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sep 21, 2018
    So happy to hear that Blue and Brat are doing much better ♥:bighug::cat:
     
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  31. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    Wonderful news!
     
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  32. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    I remember the hospital days and separating the meds a week at a time. I had to have day and night containers too. I felt like a pharmacist cutting and weighing on my gram scale to get the perfect dose.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2021
  33. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2020
    They are both doing great. Eating like crazy.
    I tested Blue +7 and he was 111. He still goes into his room to nap but he's out and about a lot now.

    Elise, wow...I wasn't thinking about going that far with meds but I might have to. I'll see how it goes.
     
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  34. Butters & Lyla

    Butters & Lyla Well-Known Member

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    May 30, 2020
    Awesome!!! :woot::woot::woot: This is all wonderful news. I'm over the moon happy for you. :bighug:
    Labeled daytime and nighttime containers is a pretty good way to keep things organized. I was doing that for Butters when she was getting multiple meds and her vitamin b.
     
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  35. Marje and Gracie

    Marje and Gracie Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2010
    I’m so glad to hear about Brat. I figured it was a toxin but was thinking of the plants be abuse I didn’t know you used chemicals to clean. I also only use soap, vinegar, baking soda. I don’t use any wipes or Clorox anywhere. I do have alcohol wipes that i use on the car, doors, my phone and purse when I’ve been out. We leave our shoes in the verwegen and sorry the soles with a water/bleach solution and they stay there until dried.

    What do they have Brat on? I hope some form of milk thistle.

    IMHO it’s the pred that’s causing the BG. He rises after you give it and is higher for severwal hours. The only way to know when it starts waning and the BG starts to drop is go test.
     
  36. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    I never thought about the cleaning but have been diligent using product I don't normally use. I'm not positive that's what caused it but can't think of anything else it would be. She is so glad to be home and wouldn't leave my lap. Blue climbed up too so I got a lot of love.

    I'll post the names tomorrow but antibiotic, app stimulate, cerenia and I can't remember the other but I think it was for acid reflux. I asked about liver support and she didn't mention milk thistle. They had a medicine they use but she didn't think Brat necessarily needed it. I'll post her updated blood work tomorrow. There's a big change.

    I guess I should test BG every hour after giving the Pred. I have had a lot going on and just forget. If I can figure it out I could make adjustments.
    Blue continues to improve but I know he'd feel better if I can give him some insulin.
     
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  37. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    I’m sure the prednisolone is raising the bg as well. As I recall he became diabetic from steroid injections but I forget why it was given to him and for how long.
     
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  38. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Denamarin? SAM-e? Hepatosyl?

    This is lovely. :cat:

    ((((Patty, Blue and Brat))))


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  39. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    I don't remember either but yes, soon after he was diagnosed with diabetes.
     
  40. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    It's Denamarin. I see it's much cheaper on Chewy. We might add it after her next blood work in 2 months.
     
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  41. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    We will deal with the prednisolone and hopefully Blue will not need much if any insulin. It’s doing its job which is so very important.
     
  42. Marje and Gracie

    Marje and Gracie Senior Member Moderator

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    May 30, 2010
    I use Herbsmith milk thistle from Chewys. It’s a powder and so much easier to use then Denamarin which is a pill that you aren’t supposed to crush and has to be given on an empty stomach. I wouldn’t wait to start her on it. It will not hurt her at all and will provide great liver support.

    I’m a big believer in not adding meds or supplements to food unless I have to (e.g. phosphorus binder must be added to the food) so I make a little slurry with something yummy and syringe it. You could use Beechnut chicken or Turkey baby food. Because I give my cats egg yolk powder twice a day, I just mix the milk thistle in with that. Liv sucks it out of the syringe :woot::woot:
     
  43. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    @Marje and Gracie That’s a really good idea to get them used to liking the syringe. Often mixed things I needed to make sure they got in baby food but didn’t do it by syringe.
     
  44. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Thank you. I've got a shipment leaving Chewy in three days so will add the milk thistle. As for the egg yolk powder, since the brand you use is not available, is there another you have used?
     
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  45. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Another question. What phosphorus binder do you use? I'm not sure if Brat needs one or not.
     
  46. Marje and Gracie

    Marje and Gracie Senior Member Moderator

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    May 30, 2010
    Does she have CKD and is her P value above 6?

    If “yes” to both, I use aluminum hydroxide powder and I believe Chewy’s also carries it.

    I am not aware of another quality egg yolk powder but FFL also has this info for making your own. It seems easy and you can make quite a bit with four eggs just to hold you over.
     
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  47. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    What is P value?

    The site not allowing me to upload jpeg of blood work.
     
  48. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    The serum phosphorus level. (P is the symbol for phosphorus in the Periodic Table.)

    I believe there's a problem with file uploads at the moment and webmaster Robert is working on it.


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  49. Patty and Blue

    Patty and Blue Well-Known Member

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    Aug 11, 2020
    Then she's probably ok if that's what it is. She at 5.
     
  50. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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