2/8 Chico PMPS 119

Marina & Chico

Marina & Chico

Very Active Member
Previous post: https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...s-feed-2-cats-like-a-pro.269326/#post-3006417

Dear FD community, we need your help once again :cat:

Updates: Chico has been doing overall pretty well, he has a healthy apetite (almost always), grooms himself, cuddles and is playfull and we are so grateful for this and we always remember that the forum is the one that gave us this possibility :bighug:

Now to the reason why we need your help yet again.

He has been having some intensive diarheea since summer and was vomiting often we switched a couple of vets since then but we finally got to a bigger clinic, that doesn't just prescribe antibiotics but actually did the leg work: they did a xray, blood tests, ultrasound and citological test and diagnosed Chico with suspicion of lymphoma. We were directed to the oncological clinic in our city, where they did more tests and hystopatology. The great result from hystopatology came and the vet concluded that Chico is not an oncological patient but that he has severe IBD.

The first recommendation was to switch a novel food. Background is that for the past 4 years we fed Chico raw turkey and pork, sometimes (when it was available rabbit) and Chico was doing pretty well until he didn't. We couldn't switch to another raw source of protein because in Czech republic there is nothing else that we could try (Chico didn't even touch BARF horse, boar and deer :banghead:). We found a commercial german brand that we were very happy with this brand: https://www.zooplus.com/shop/cats/c...z_finefood_cans/525030?activeVariant=525030.2
We tried cangoroo, that didnt work and then we tried sheep and for 2 months it was going very well, Chico started having much better formed bowel movement, stopped vomiting as much. Unfortunately last week we noticed that his bowel stopped being as nice and he vomitted 4 times in 3 days, one day he didn't want to eat. There are no further new protein sources that we can try:arghh:
Yesterday we went back to the vet and the next proposed steps were to look into antiinfamatory, they proposed 2 options: one that starts with G and theoretically works but earliest would have some efect in 1 month, on the positive note it would not affect his sugar levels and the second one would be prednisolone but that it affects sugar levels. The clinic is very wary of going to prednisolone for a diabetic cat.

I know that there is plenty of experience on the forum with IBD, prednisolone and FD but i couldn't find the right posts to read nor some spreadsheets to help us get a better idea of what could we expect. The vet is willing to look into this data to decide if they could consider prednisolone for Chico or not. Can you please help us with the sources?

Thank you again very much :bighug:
 
I'm sorry I have no experience with this, Marina, but am commenting to bump your post. Also, you might post this question/concern in the main forum as well.
 
Hi Marina! :-)

I don't have any experience with IBD, but I have come across these websites:
https://www.ibdkitties.net/
https://www.rawfeedingforibdcats.org/

Is Chico on any probiotic? I've read about probiotics like Visbiome, Proviable etc for cats with IBD here on the Board.
The other steroid that some people try for IBD is Budesonide rather than Prednisolone. For some cats, Bude does not elevate BG like Pred does.

I'm also going to tag @Margaret (and Pearl) who has experience with IBD.
 
I am sorry this is happening. One of my cats had severe diarrhea and everything she ate came out the other end. Her biopsy was inconclusive so I tried S Boulardii. She lost her appetite too. She was oven a strong probiotic and was on prednisolone for several months. I still don’t know the cause. It might have been she could not handle beef and lamb but before this happened she could eat anything and my vet said it was likely scl . Now he says it’s not and not IBD either. I still give her the probiotic Visbiome and she’s been eating pork ever since.
There’s a group on groupsio that had a strong moderator and a vet that chimes in. Here’s the link.
https://groups.io/g/Feline_Smallcell_Lymphoma
 
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Hi Marina! I'm sorry that I am seeing this so late, but I wanted to chime in because Chispa had IBD/SCL for about five years and was on prednisolone the whole time. I learned a lot and am happy to share my experiences, keeping in mind that every cat is different.

The most important thing I learned is that there is NO such thing as a "puker." If a cat is vomiting more often than once every month or so, there's a problem and you need to see a vet. (I'm saying this not for your benefit, because you've already done that, but for anyone who might read this and not know it yet -- a frequently vomiting cat really does need medical attention.)

Anyway ... as soon as Chispa was diagnosed, I joined the SCL group that Elise has referenced above. The moderator is VERY knowledgeable, and a kind person as well, despite her "my way or the highway" stance. It's an excellent resource -- but I would caution you that they won't admit new members unless you are willing to have a biopsy done on your cat, because that is the only way to know for sure whether it's IBD or SCL. I did a LOT of research and talked to three different vets, including two internists, and all three told me that it is perfectly acceptable to skip the biopsy and try putting the cat on prednisolone to see if the symptoms abate. Prednisolone may not work, or it may work for a while but eventually stop working -- and if that happens, then you can go to chlorambucil, which is the chemotherapy drug that they would start immediately if biopsied and found to be SCL. That was the path that I chose (no biopsy), and it worked out very well for Chispa. But my brief time on the SCL forum traumatized me by second-guessing everything that I was told by a vet whom I had trusted for ten years and two others whom I knew to be experts.

It's true that prednisolone affects sugar levels, and I was told that a diabetic cat on pred is unlikely to ever go into remission. But pred was a miracle drug for Chispa -- it turned her digestive issues around almost instantly, and as a bonus, she stopped licking all her fur off, which she had been doing for six years prior to that (and we had tried EVERYTHING). Budesonide didn't work for her, unfortunately, but it works for many IBD cats and does not affect BG (or not as much as pred, anyway).

I can also second Elise's recommendation of Visbiome. Chispa had severe diarrhea while on antibiotics, and Visbiome stopped it completely within a couple of days. I had tried other remedies, but Visbiome was the one that actually worked -- almost miraculously!

Good luck to you and Chico -- I hope you can get his digestion back on track very soon. :bighug:
 
Bandit's Mom said:
Hi Marina! :)

I don't have any experience with IBD, but I have come across these websites:
https://www.ibdkitties.net/
https://www.rawfeedingforibdcats.org/

Is Chico on any probiotic? I've read about probiotics like Visbiome, Proviable etc for cats with IBD here on the Board.
The other steroid that some people try for IBD is Budesonide rather than Prednisolone. For some cats, Bude does not elevate BG like Pred does.

I'm also going to tag @Margaret (and Pearl) who has experience with IBD.
Click to expand...

Hi Bhooma,

I really appreciate the resources. Chico is on Boulardi. We cannot feed raw anyore though :( this is so upseting because he developed intolerance to the protein sources we are able to get our hands on...

But thank you so much for your message :bighug:
 
tiffmaxee said:
I am sorry this is happening. One of my cats had severe diarrhea and everything she ate came out the other end. Her biopsy was inconclusive so I tried S Boulardii. She lost her appetite too. She was oven a strong probiotic and was on prednisolone for several months. I still don’t know the cause. It might have been she could not handle beef and lamb but before this happened she could eat anything and my vet said it was likely scl . Now he says it’s not and not IBD either. I still give her the probiotic Visbiome and she’s been eating pork ever since.
There’s a group on groupsio that had a strong moderator and a vet that chimes in. Here’s the link.
https://groups.io/g/Feline_Smallcell_Lymphoma
Click to expand...
Thank you so much for sharing your experience, i really appreciate and we will look in to the forum you provided :bighug:
 
Karen and Chispa (GA) said:
Hi Marina! I'm sorry that I am seeing this so late, but I wanted to chime in because Chispa had IBD/SCL for about five years and was on prednisolone the whole time. I learned a lot and am happy to share my experiences, keeping in mind that every cat is different.

The most important thing I learned is that there is NO such thing as a "puker." If a cat is vomiting more often than once every month or so, there's a problem and you need to see a vet. (I'm saying this not for your benefit, because you've already done that, but for anyone who might read this and not know it yet -- a frequently vomiting cat really does need medical attention.)

Anyway ... as soon as Chispa was diagnosed, I joined the SCL group that Elise has referenced above. The moderator is VERY knowledgeable, and a kind person as well, despite her "my way or the highway" stance. It's an excellent resource -- but I would caution you that they won't admit new members unless you are willing to have a biopsy done on your cat, because that is the only way to know for sure whether it's IBD or SCL. I did a LOT of research and talked to three different vets, including two internists, and all three told me that it is perfectly acceptable to skip the biopsy and try putting the cat on prednisolone to see if the symptoms abate. Prednisolone may not work, or it may work for a while but eventually stop working -- and if that happens, then you can go to chlorambucil, which is the chemotherapy drug that they would start immediately if biopsied and found to be SCL. That was the path that I chose (no biopsy), and it worked out very well for Chispa. But my brief time on the SCL forum traumatized me by second-guessing everything that I was told by a vet whom I had trusted for ten years and two others whom I knew to be experts.

It's true that prednisolone affects sugar levels, and I was told that a diabetic cat on pred is unlikely to ever go into remission. But pred was a miracle drug for Chispa -- it turned her digestive issues around almost instantly, and as a bonus, she stopped licking all her fur off, which she had been doing for six years prior to that (and we had tried EVERYTHING). Budesonide didn't work for her, unfortunately, but it works for many IBD cats and does not affect BG (or not as much as pred, anyway).

I can also second Elise's recommendation of Visbiome. Chispa had severe diarrhea while on antibiotics, and Visbiome stopped it completely within a couple of days. I had tried other remedies, but Visbiome was the one that actually worked -- almost miraculously!

Good luck to you and Chico -- I hope you can get his digestion back on track very soon. :bighug:
Click to expand...
Thank you soo much for your extensive reply, i will write in private in order to ask you more questions if you don't mind :bighug:
 
Hi @Marina & Chico I'm really sorry I didn't see @Bandit's Mom tag earlier in February. My civvie Chessie had horrendous IBD. And all of my seniors have struggled with it, Pearl has had it badly also. Here's the deal - if you have to do Pred, you have to do it. It is what it is. Many diabetic cats are on Pred (including Pearl) and I can help you understand how to adjust insulin dosing for that. Pearl taught me a LOT having diabetes and needing to be on Pred for multiple conditions that really required it. So I would not hesitate to try it.

One other thing is that Chico may be intolerant to the preservatives and gums used in canning - so even if a novel protein was enjoyable to him, he might not tolerate it. So remember to add this factor in as you are trying things. Chessie could not have ANY canned cat foods. She survived her last 2 years with me on home-cooked meats and on Gerber baby food with added cat nutrients. She was on incredibly high doses of Pred (IBD plus tick-borne illness contributing to it). Pearl was on a moderate dose of 2.5mg Pred with every insulin shot (so that you don't have one high cycle when the Pred kicks in and one low cycle as the Pred wears off - keeps things even).

And yes to S. Boullardii + MOS probiotic by Jarrow if you can get it. There is a stop diarrhea protocol for IBD that requires using as many capsules a day as needed (Chessie was on about 6).

Does this help at all?
 
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