Help giving insulin after hypo incident and update

To everyone-

Thank you so much for last nite I really appreciate it.I couldn't have done it without you guys. Spicey is doing great but

I do need help with giving her insulin.

I just tested her and she is currently at 521.

I think the meter or the strips were not working properly because i bought today the relion micro and it seems to give a better reading.

She is currently on Pzi Vet insulin and she has not had any insulin today due to the hypo incident if the #s were correct.

So I need help guys please.

 

Re: Update on Spicey Last nite hypo incident

That high a number is to be expected after such a low number, rebound happens and may take a few days to diminish. My Pippin can go from 60 to 600 in a few hours LOL.
One thing you dont want to do is to let him go that low again if you can help it.
I am sure more knowledgeable people will be along soon, I just wanted to let you know the high number isnt an emergency but a rebound.
Rebound will clear and isnt an indication to raise the dose.

 

Hello, again.
We were wondering how Spice was doing. I am so happy to hear that she made it safely thru the night ))))

One thing that I do want to point out -
It is completely normal for a kitty to have very high numbers the next day after a hypo event.
Last night - for hours - Spice was fed sugar and high carb foods in order to bring her bgl up to a safe number from a dangerously low number.
Now, it goes high because of all of the sugars that were pumped into her. It is NORMAL for that to happen after a hypo event. I promise.

There is a saying that goes something like, "Better to be too high for a day, than too low for even one minute". Low blood sugar can cause terrible, terrible things to happen - including possible death.

I would strongly encourage you to decrease Spice's insulin to 1 unit twice daily and feed her nothing but low carb. canned foods from here on out. The canned Friskie's Special Diet (beef & chicken??) that she likes would be ideal to start her out on. Please do NOT feed her only those low carb foods if you are not going to decrease her insulin, or she might hypo on you again.

Spice would not have hypoed on NYE, and again last night were she not getting too much insulin for her body. The safest way to avoid another hypo event is decrease insulin to 1 unit to start, monitor her bgl at least before every single shot (and preferably at least 4 times a day) and feed her only low carb wet food.

After a few days at 1 unit 2X per day, with frequent monitoring, you will be able to tell if she needs more insulin. If she does, the dose should be increased v e r y s l o w l y by .25 to .5 units at a time (and held on new dose for a few days to allow it to settle). That is the safest way to increase insulin doses. Start low - go slow. It saves a lot of lives and allows a person to tell what the ideal dose is for their particular cat.

~M

 

Question how many days on 1 unit and when will i tell if she needs more insulin?

And should i feed her the wet food friskies special diet beef and chicken or

Feed her the wet food hills prescriptive m/d

She really prefers the wet food hills prescriptive m/d over the wet friskies.

I Know the reason she had the hypo incident on new years eve is that she wasn't eating at all and i did not catch that so I need to keep that in mind. She hardley eats the wet friskies she just licks it and doesn't actualyy eat it. But she gobbles up the hills wet.

 

i gave spicey her insulin 1 unit.

 

The wet Friskies is going to be lower in carbs than the wet Hill's - and the Friskies is, actually, a better food than the Hill's, (not to mention cheaper), as it has more meat in it.

There are a lot of low carb options out there that you can pick up at the grocery store that will cost you much less than the Hill's - AND be better for Spice. Fancy Feast is one option - the "gourmet" styles are the lowest in carbs. http://www.felinediabetes.com/glutenfree.htm

Wellness grain free, Evo cat & kitten, and Evo 95% meat are also excellent options - and still cheaper than the Hill's...

There are so many food choices that you can try for Spice that are going to be better options than the Hill's.
Just stick with low carb varieties of canned food and you should be okay on the diet. Have you seen the full Janet & Binky's list yet? http://www.felinediabetes.com/diabetic-cat-diets.htm

All the work has been done for you in finding out the carb content of many different flavors/brands of canned food. Just look for ones that are less than 10% in carbs (I feed less than 5% in carbs for my sugar cat who is now completely diet controlled!!)


Anyway, lowering her carb intake and decreasing the insulin amount, to start, will be of great benefit to her.
Generally you need to allow at least three days, preferably 4 to 5 days, before you increase the dose to the next amount - and then you do it gradually, VERY gradually, by .25 to .5 units at a time. Hold on that dose and see if you are reaching good numbers.

There are a lot of people here who track their kitty's bgl numbers on a spreadsheet using google docs.
The spreadsheet is then linked to the profile so that anyone can look at the numbers to see if the kitty is doing well on a particular type/dose of insulin. That might be something you could consider doing, as well. For you, your vet, and people trying to help you with dosing - having all of that data instantly available is quite helpful.

~M

 

Thank you so much for giving her that lower dose. *whew*
I honestly want to cry tears of relief right now at "hearing" you say that.

~M

 

Like others have said, it's not surprising that the number is so high tonight. We expect that. So, I really do not think that the meter was not working.

See what happens with 1 unit for three or four days - testing before each shot and then getting some random spot checks in between. You definitely want to record each number at at what hour it was after the shot. We can help you with a spreadsheet or you can just log it... but we'll need to see ALL the numbers together in order to see the pattern and determine how well and when your kitty reacts to the insulin.

Please keep posting when you have numbers and questions.

 

Thanx Guys I really do aprreciate it.

 

You are very welcome.
And what is your name, by the way?

~M

 

Do I need to test her always before giving a shot. And Should I test her afterwards?

And those spreadsheets are confusing. I don't know if I can get 4 readings a day since I work full time except on my days off.

 

My name is David

And I ltry to upload a pic of spice soon.

 

LOL! Hi David! :smile: As everyone thought you were Spice's mommy. :razz:

Sorry, I didn't see this thread before replying on the last one. I posted the food chart on the other thread in case he hasn't seen it yet. I saw his update on that thread & didn't think anyone had seen it yet.

 

Hi David....


yes, you should test before each shot at the very least. That tells you whether or not it's safe to give insulin. Without testing, one might give insulin at an already low number and that is very dangerous. So always before the test.

The tests between shots can be any time you can get one... generally they are on the hour or half hour (good for records) but that is not essential. If you can get one or two in between shot at one of the cycles in the day... like two hours after an evening shot and then right before bed... You don't have to do both cycles in the day - it just shows a better picture.

Then, after a settling time - and that depends on the insulin type and how kitty is responding - you will need to do a curve on a weekend day. It sounds more time consuming than it is. It's testing as close to every two hours between shots for one cycle. This gives you a clear indication of how well the insulin works and when the low point (the nadir) is in the curve. It's called a curve because if you graph the numbers, it makes a U or V shape... you ideally want a gentle smile in the curve. The stronger shapes mean the insulin is working faster than you like and isn't lasting as long... or the dose is not quite right.

From there, you can increase the dose by a smidgen (normally .25 or .5 units (a quarter or half unit))... or lower the dose if needed. Some cats do only need a portion of a unit - I know it seems small but it's powerful stuff.


I hope that helps a bit... Like I said... no need to worry so much about how many times a day... just make sure you do it before each shot...

How are you feeling with all of this now?

 

I am spicey's mom in a way. lol

 

This is Very helpful. I cannot believe the Vet did not tell me any of this. Thank you so much.

 

Yes, David - you always need to test her every single time before giving her an injection. Preferably, she will not have had any food for at least 4 hours prior to the pre-shot test.

The AM pre-shot test is referred to as: AMPS - and the PM pre-shot test is referred to as: PMPS

On your days off you can get more tests in than just those two, and if the spreadsheets are confusing to you, you can keep the data in a note pad format, or use MS excel if you are comfortable with that program (that is what I do and I can print the logs, or copy/paste them here if I ever needed to).

SO your log would look something like this:

12/Jan/10

AMPS 95 (just a made up # for teaching purposes) gave 0 unit
+1
+2
+3
+4
+5
+5
+7
+8
+9
+10
+11
+12
PMPS 521 - gave 1 unit
+1
+2
+3
+4
+5
+6
+7
+8
+9
+10
+11
+12

So, you test/shoot at 10AM/PM - those number go into the AMPS, or PMPS space.
The other numbers are the hours after the shot (no shot if under 180 bgl for now)
and you fill those spaces in if/when you test her and have her bgl reading.
You keep a log for every single day. Using notepad, or MS excel, you can copy the format and
paste it onto a new spot each day, ALWAYS saving the data afterward.

Understand? If not, I will try to explain better...

I sincerely hope that we are not overloading you with info here. Brain explosions are common from all of this data being thrown at you fast and furious. *grin* Seriously, if you are not clear on something - ask.
You will get a response in short order.

We'd all love to see pictures of your Spicey girl

~M

 

It is becoming cleare thanx.

 

One thing to add to Mary's excellent example... If you give a shot, it's either AMPS or PMPS... but, at the next cycle, you cannot give the shot at the AM or PM Preshot... then you are still counting the hours since the last shot... So, if you gave an am dose but it's too low at pm to give a shot... then it's recorded as +12, then +14 and so on until the next dose... Some people record up to +72 and then need to give a smidgen of insulin.... so they start over at an AM or PM preshot and go from there....

It make is easier for all of us to know how many hours it's been since the last shot...so we know where in the cycle she is... And we are all over the world so the time of day is different for all of us.

 

When you get a moment, please look in the manual for your Relion meter and call their customer service and request a bottle of control solution. They will send it to you absolutely free, and the number is staffed 24/7. Every time you get a new package of test strips, test 1 using the control solution to make sure the packet is acceptable. If you get a packet that tests out of range, try again. If it tests off twice - call their customer service again and tell them. I had it happen to me once and they sent me a new packet of test strips immediately with a pre-paid mailer to send the suspect packet back to them for quality control testing. They were incredibly polite and helpful about it all. The control solution is good for 3 months, and everytime its about to expire you just call their toll-free number and they'll send you out a new bottle.

Top rate customer service from such a reasonably priced meter/strip company. I was very impressed with them.

 

Hi David-

I'm so glad Spice is okay after the incident the other day. I thought you were Spice's "mommy" too. Spice is very cute, btw! And you have 3 other cats? What are their names?

 

the other cats names are Diva, Zayla, and Squeeky

 

Hey David-

Did you notice that you've been a member since Aug 31, 2010? That's interesting! :lol: I wonder how that happened?