Low phosphorus & carb for Fistuk

Hi everyone

I'm looking for advice on changing Fistuk's food to support his CKD.

Last lab results are in the SS. His liver values were a bit high and creatinine high. He had a bit of URI in the time of the test. It's getting better now.

Vet suggested to change his food to low salt. She said - don't know why - that she's not so concerned by the phosphorus now or to add phosphorus binder.

She suggested starting with Renax tablets (https://inuvet.com/en-gb/products/renax/). He's been getting it for a couple of weeks and it's doing his bowl movement good.

Fistuk is also getting now 60ml SQ almost daily.

@Suzanne & Darcy I would appreciate your eyes on Fistuk's lab results

I see that Weruva is repeatedly recommended here. They seem to be quite pricey and also I'll need to add seeping costs to Switzerland so I'm looking for other options.

Is there a calculator for phosphorus like I have for calculating carb dry matter? That way I can look at the available products here.

When Fistuk was Dx I checked every single brand in the shop with the calculator and managed to find 4% carb and also low fat (for his pancreatitis) that works really well for him. Something similar to calculate phosphorus and salt would be amazing.

Also, what should I look for in terms of phosphorus and salt levels?
@Bandit's Mom @Bron and Sheba (GA) @Diane Tyler's Mom would love your feedback

For those of you who know Fistuk and have been with us from the beginning of our journey, we both want to say a huge thank you for your help and guidance!

Fistuk is doing really well. His BG is regulated and I feel confident and with enough knowledge to support his diabetic needs

Thanks of much for your help

 

Phosphorus levels are more important for managing kidney issues, not liver values. You might want to ask your vet about calcitriol. One of my cats has had higher creatinine levels and they have been stable for years on a dose of calcitriol.

For liver support, I would suggest looking into Denamarin (with SAM-e) -- typical dose is 90 mg and is given once a day at least 1 hour before a meal.

Milk thistle (silymarin) is also used for liver support.

 

Thanks, Sienne

The vet suggested to focus on kidney and not the liver value. Which is why I asked about phosphorus (and salt for lower blood pressure).

The Renax tablets have milk thistle.

For the high creatinine she suggested HEEL SUC homeopathy. I read on Tanya's website that there are good results for it. I'll buy it soon as I get my salary...

 

Sorry if I misread the vet's thinking. Kidneys are a vulnerable point for cats and it makes sense to make good choices regarding diet. I believe Tanya's site has a message board. I would ask there if there are European members who can recommend low phos/low carb food since there are brands that are not available in the US that are available in Europe. Shipping on US brands would be very costly.

You might want to take a look at this list from the CKD Facebook group. It looks like there's a link to European cat food.

 

NP Sienne I appreciate your support and your input was a reinforcement which is important.

So far I've received such a valuable and wise guidance in this community that I trust the information I get in here more than anything!

In this regard, I did join the Tanya's forum but so far didn't have a great experience. I did ask about food but nothing came of it.

When I google in German I see that there are local companies in Germany and Switzerland who produce food for cats with specific considerations. I'll explore them too.

That's great!! Thank yo. I'll explore it. I already recognise some of the brand names

 

@Sienne and Gabby (GA) do you know what I should aim for in terms of phosphorus mg/100cal?

 

I don't! I've always referred people to Tanya's website. I'm going to tag @Suzanne & Darcy. She may have the info at her fingertips.

This is a link to our FAQ page on CKD. I skimmed several of the links and there's no info on phos levels.

 

The UK Cat Food List also lists phosphorus in some cases. Many of the options are available in Europe. Ideally you'd like 1% and under for phosphorus (P) by DMB (dry matter basis). Actually Felinecrf recommends under 0.5%, but only "therapeutic" foods are that low. So just go for as low as you can get.

 

Hi Shelley and Fistuk, my kitty also has very early CKD. Did you and your vet make a decision on how to proceed? We are looking at Hill's Science Diet 11+ as a reasonable option. I look forward to your reply. Thanks and hope you are Fistuk are managing well

 

Thanks, Wendy. I'm exploring this list.
I'm also looking into getting in touch with a nutritions to make food that will accommodate all his needs

 

Hi Natashya
I'm not in favour of CKD prescribe food, especially by big brands. And I was happy to see that on the document that Wendy linked to they explain why it's not a good idea.
I haven't yet found something but I'm happy to update once I did.
I might just go to a nutritionist and get him a tailored made food.
I hope you find something the works well for Mrs Jones

 

Hello! I've had success with her eating Weruva Wx Phos Focus. I'm still mixing dry food in during this transition time but so far, so good. When you go to a nutritionist, I'd love to hear what is recommended. All the best with the Fistuk and food this week

 

Hello Shelly and Fistuk!

I've come here from Tanya's CKD support group, and I highly recommend it.

Here is a phosphorus DMB calculator: https://catcentric.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/DMB-Calculator-Excel-97-2003.xls
You can also use these online tools, like this one: http://felinenutritioncalculators.com/dmb.html?inputboxm=82.6&inputboxi=0.15&button.x=0&button.y=0

A list of European low phosphorus commercial foods: https://www.bizave.com/foodlists/Europe_UK_CKD_Food_List.pdf

The AAFCO recommendation on Phosphorus intake for CKD cats is to aim at max 0.6% DMB or/and less than 250mg/100 kcal. In general, it's good to be between 50mg and 128mg per 100 kcal. For non-CKD cats, the Safe Upper Limit of Phosphorus intake is set by the AAFCO at 2.5 g/1000 kcal, but because the AAFCO has no jurisdiction, this rule has not been implemented.

Sodium has to be limited not because of hypertension, contrary to us, but because of the part it plays in the calcium and phosphorus catabolism and metabolism -> the more sodium there is, the more phosphorus will be "absorbed" by the organism. For CKD it's good to aim at less than 200mg/100 kcal.

I'm a maniac with feline nutrition, so I've been accumulating studies, if you wish I could send you a couple of links.

Do join the Tanya's CKD group! https://tanyackd.groups.io/g/support