? 11/29 Texas Gizmo PMPS=166, +1.5=219, +3.5=229, +5=199

11/28

AMPS=191

Almost a clean bowl cat this morning. Ate all but a tiny bit of his PS meal!!

Just a note of interest - the Mirtz he got at 12 midnight (+7.5) last night was from the new prescription and he is acting (vocal, ravishing hungry, purry) more like he normally would with Mirtz. Can't say for sure that it is the new rx but the old one was almost two years old! (Theory it may have lost some potency?)

OR - it could just be him being a cat

Still waiting on the culture results from the urinalysis. Would that be something that the culture would show? If not I can give them a call and request the urine protein:creatinine ratio. I was going to wait to post everything until I go those. I have attached the urnie results I have so far (just go them late yesterday afternoon and the culture results should be back by the end of the week).

ETA - is the PH something I need to worry about? If so, what do I do?

Lovely, another thing to have to try and figure out in the food area. So I need more calories vs. more protein? Any suggestions on how to do that using the low phos foods? The higher calorie foods (Tiki) are zero calorie and I really don't want to go that route (plus he seems to like them but not crazy about them).

Going to get into the shower. Need to go run some errands later this morning after his nadir (if he gives me permission, as Judy would say)

 

I'm glad Gizmo is eating for you this morning. The old Mirtz could have lost its potency. That is pretty old. Sending prayers.

 

Hey, we are testing for possible proteinuria at Marje's suggestion. It's a separate test from a culture, and not cheap, at around $100 a pop. We just submitted urine for the last of three necessary tests and await results. Maggie's has been .4. Appears to be common in cats with CKD. Here's the link to Tanya's write up: http://www.felinecrf.org/proteinuria.htm

 

Prayers over you and Gizmo today, Lizzie

 

Much appreciated

Been busy cleaning up the disaster of the house from the past few days. Broke down the force feeding area and washed all the sheets and towels used. Broke out the wet/dry vac and cleaned the puddng poo spots. Cleaned out the refridge of all the old food. Got his 8am meds into him though he ended up wearing more of the AB than what I got into him I think .

Praying he eats at 9am (+4.5, about 15 min) if not I will have to force feed HC depending on his numbers. Will test for ketones at the +4.5 test also.

Then I get to eat bfast, fold MY laundry and hopefully he is past nadir so I can go pick up his meds at the vets and run to the grocery store and Wal-Mart (oh yay)

 

Ok, feel much better with that +4.5 number. Still have to get him to eat but ketone meter came back with "LO" after test - what does that mean? The ketone meter test had plenty of blood so I am pretty sure it a good test.

 

Zero experience with keytones (or keytones meters for that matter), bumping for you

 

Thank you. I really need to know.

@Wendy&Neko @Gill & George

 

Thanks for posting the full urine results. I expected there to be protein in his urine since his MA is high but there isn’t so it won’t do you any good to do the protein:creatinine ratio. I would wait until he gets through this bout and then run another urine sample in and see if the MA has come down. While it is usually attributable to CKD, it could also be related to his concurrent issues. Let’s just wait for his urine culture to come back.

His pH is normal. The normal range is 5.5 - 7.0. I wouldn’t worry about LO ketones on the meter. Those meters are designed for humans and I’ve gotten some numbers lower than I would have expected. It’s the higher ones we worry about.

I’m just suggesting feeding him more calories to help ward off any chance of DKA. Appropriate level of Insulin + calories + fluids help in that respect. So if you can’t find any that are low P, then just feed him a little more of his regular food...just until he is better. I just thought if he wasn’t eating well, getting a food into him with more calories would be easier than trying to get more food into him that had less calories.

 

Paws crossed for Gizmo

 

Thank you. On my way to the vets to pick up meds and am going to get some Royal Canin and A/D. We are back to iffy eating. He may have gotten about 3 oz in so far today and that has been a struggle. Am going to wait a bit closer to feeding to give the Mirtz this evening (closer to the start of his cycle).

ETA - retested for ketones and it was 0.2 on the meter - whew.

 

The latest study shows Mirtz lasts about 9 hours, so good idea to give it closer to feeding then it'll do some good. If there is a next time, might want to see if you can get the transdermal kind which is supposed to be slower gentler and less of the odd side effects.

Glad the ketones are neg. And that you are getting out of the house.

Neko had proteinuria - we tested for it when the protein level in her urine got to +2-+3.

 

Lizzie, what ketone meter do u use ??? Sounds like ur having a lovely “ day off”

 

Thank you @Marje and Gracie and @Wendy&Neko

I am flying by the seat of my pants. I am thinking about giving the Mirtz about 30 min before PS - what do you think? I HAVE GOT to get him eating. I got the A/D and the Royal. Trying the A/D and he has eaten a bit of it on his own but will syringe (force feed) in a bit if he doesn't eat any more. He seems to be in quite a bit of pain right now. Gave him his dose of Bupe as soon as I walked in the door. RX states every 8 hours and I feel he needs it every 6. I hate this stuff. I feel like he is slowly giving up. If I can't get him to start eating I am going to have to make some hard decisions.

Nova Max.

This one:
https://www.adwdiabetes.com/product/3401/nova-max-plus-glucose-ketone-meter-kit

 

Vets gave me data sheets for the Royal Recovery and the A/D. Here they are for anyone who wants them for your records.

 

I’ve never used Mirtz so I’m not much help there. I’ll leave that to those that have used it.

Bupe has a wide dosing range so you could potentially give him less every six hours so he doesn’t have breakthrough pain. You might want to confirm with your vet on that but I wouldn’t give him the dose they prescribed every six hours.

 

Bupe is dosed by weight of cat, with a range for each weight. The more you give, the longer it's supposed to last. I would definitely check dosing with the vet.

 

Gizmo seems to be eating, just not enough, not yet.

Several months ago, I was slowly giving up on TiTi. She was far less perky, having bouts of pancreatitis, and according to the "experts"- if she does have acro - she was on her last days of life. 3 years, it seems is the average. This coming March it will be 4 years, and even though she isn't as perky as she was, she is still very interested in living. So I was wrong. I was also exhausted, and though I hadn't just survived a terrible flood, as you have, I was also going thru some hard times.
Maybe Gizmo is slowly giving up, but is it possible that you are slowly giving up? It's an incredibly discouraging disease, and it is progressive, so some diminishing of our cats' abilities is sure to occur.
Right now you are exhausted, burned out, and frankly, it's amazing that you are still able to do anything other than fall unconscious to the floor, thus getting some much needed sleep.

That said, I know, as do we all, that you are the best judge of Gizmo and you're a very smart cookie. I do think, however, that you need to get in a few days of deep refreshing sleep. If a few margaritas might help, by all means break out the limes!
Hugs

 

Sorry, I wasn't about earlier, I think you have the answers you were looking for.
I'm glad ketones are negative. Sending appy, feel better vines for Giz.
Some of these for you.

 

I need someone to help with the meds schedule. I screwed up and gave pain meds at the wrong time and now I am all confused.

Can someone double check this schedule?


I would like to move the Ondansteron and Cerenia to 4a/4p so he is getting the benefit of it during his cycle.

 

The only thing I see is you have the Ondansteron at 8AM and 4PM. That is not 12 hours.

 

Thank you Carla

I gave the Ondansteron at 8:00 am this morning and just gave the 2nd one at 4:00pm (right now) - like I said, I am trying to adjust the timing and since I screwed up the pain meds I need to get it documented and posted in front of my face so I don't screw it up again! I really want to adjust the Cerenia to 4am also but not sure about that one so I will leave it for now.

How does this look?

I gave pain meds at Noon (12p) today. I just want to make sure that I don't screw up again.

 

PMPS=166

History:
AMPS=191, +2.5=122, +3.5=93, +4.5=101, +6=123, Ket=0.2 (Neg), +8=174, +11=192

 

I'm sorry you are going through such a tough spell with Gizmo. I didn't keep up over Thanksgiving.
For what it's worth, I picked up some Cat-sushi bonito flakes today and sprinkled them on Yum's food. Huge success.
Yum has CKD. She has only had protein in her urine when she has a concurrent UTI.

 

If I can't get him to eat how do I keep him from going hypo?

I could kill my husband right now. I was just getting him to eat when he showed up and Gizmo stopped. This is after a year of telling him to NOT show up at t/f/s time. Big ol knock down yelling match and tears ensued. Literally have told him almost daily and he knows the schedule.

 

Is shooting him completely out of the question?

 

No.

 

I think the schedule looks fine now. Hopefully the meds will help him feel better soon and he'll eat better for you. Sorry about your DH.

You can always rub honey or karo on their gums if they won't eat. Hopefully it won't come to that.

 

He is currently attempting to syringe feed. Gizmo is growling and fighting him.

 

Here is the list of things to tempt cats to eat in case anything may help Gizmo. Sending prayers.

Do you have any parmesan cheese? If you maybe sprinkle a little of that on her food, she will perhaps eat? usually ondansetron is better for nausea than cerenia but it doesn't hurt to give her the cerenia....it can help.

Can you finger feed her....either see if she will lick food off your finger or will she let you dab some on the front of her tongue or on the roof of her mouth? Just be careful that it's only a small amount and that you don't get it down her throat.

Here's some info Jill often posts when a kitty won't eat:Here are some things you can do do entice your cat to eat:

-sometimes in order to get a cat to eat you even have to resort to dry it is more important that they eat. there are a couple low carb / grain free brands -- EVO and wellness core.

-making a buffet to give him choices
- heating food

sprinkle food with :
- forta flora -- a probiotic you can get at vets or online. is very smelly and cats love the taste of it.
- parm. cheese
- smashed crumbles of dry food
- Purebites Duck Liver -- crushed and put on as a topper.
- bonito tuna flakes
- halo chicken treats -- crumble into dust over food
- poor a little water from tuna in water over food ( I use low sodium/no sodium added as other kinds in water has veg. broth in it and I assume that means onions, which are toxic to cats-- check labels)
-powdered oregano. yep sounds weird . but some cats like it and it will entice them to eat.

other ideas of foods to offer your kitty to stim appy:
- trader joe tuna for cats
-baby food -- beechnut turkey and broth or chicken and broth. they have no onions or other additives. some babyfoods have onions . please read labels if you can't find beechnut.
- kentucky fried chicken
- deli turkey /chicken
- plain cooked ( boiled or baked ) chicken breast
-canned chicken for people (watch the label that their are no onions)
- chicken broth -- low sodium

 

Just catching up. So sorry that Gizmo isn't eating again. That is frustrating.
Sending eating and feel better vines for Gizmo.

 

​

 

I'm sorry Gizmo isn't feeling well still. Hopefully he starts showing improvement soon.

many many many vines and hugs

 

Feel better vines for Gizmo and you Lizzie

 

Thanks everyone. I just ran to the grocery store and picked up "bad" food. I got Fancy Feast T&G, more of the Meow Mix he is eating and a couple of other fish. As much as I didn't want to go down this path - he has forced my hand.

He has gotten about 1/2 oz of the A/D force fed. The Meow Mix is what I was using to give the Canna

These are the two I had (and got more of)
MEOW MIX - Tender Favorites in Sauce Salmon & Crab 2.75oz
Protein:68
Fat: 29
Carbs: 3
Phos: 298
Calories/2.75oz: 57

And
MEOW MIX - Tender Favorites in Sauce Tuna & Shrimp 2.75oz
Protein: 66
Fat: 33
Carbs: 2
Phos: 260
Calories/2.75oz: 63

He has eaten just over 1/2 "can" (they come in little 2.75oz cups) of the 2nd one. He will eat a bit and go lay back down and then, either we will encourage him and he will eat a couple more bites or he will just get up and go to the bowl on his own but he will only eat a bite or two at a time.

Is it ok to leave food out, available to him all the time, while he is getting through this? (i.e., free feed) And basically screw the numbers and schedules (except for shot time)? Any previous time I went through this he was NOT diabetic so I have no idea what I am doing.

 

I think getting him to eat trumps everything. You can always adjust his dose if you need to. If you need to leave food out for him to eat, I'd do it.

 

Omg Lizzie, hang in there. But I’m glad Giz is home and at least eating some.

The only thing I’d add to food possibilities is to think foods that are more easily digested even if it’s baby food or the recovery or a/d with enticing toppers for dish food or blender it together for assist feeding.

Also, have you tried the Raw Liver Shake for Gizmo? If you haven’t tried it yet, might be worth a try.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/the-liver-shake-for-sick-cats.30432/

Azalea seems/seemed to prefer the rc recovery instead of the hills a/d during the times when all else except liver shake are/were not to her interest. It’s more mousse-like than a/d, too. I’ve even mixed plain chicken broth and water or some liver shake and water with it for assist feeding. Plenty of times azalea’s had rls as an “appetizer” first, and then she’ll switch to the other food dish offering.

Do you use any of the Standard process glandular supports?

Sending boat loads of ❤️❤️ vines for you and Giz and try to get some rest ❤️❤️. Sending vines too for patience pants with DH (I relate: Azalea gets totally distracted when DH appears early on in assist feeding...getting her back in the rhythm to be sure she gets all of the meal becomes...well... but Azalea is a happy with her best buddy.

ETA: just read your just above. Thumbs up on the food interest. Another “crummy” food possibility might be Sheba pates along with the ones you got. If giz goes for the grocery store fuds, maybe mix a bit of one he likes in with the a/d or recovery? Whatever helps him to eat, right? ❤️

 

Thank you so much. I forgot about the liver shake. I am going to go look at it now. I don't know what the Standard Process Glandular Support is? I have never heard of it.

 

Lizzie, you are an amazing kitty momma ...you are doing all you can do and I hope are taking care of yourself as well. Many and constant prayers for Gizmo and for you

 

lolol. Go for it!

 

t\This is so organized! I am impressed.

 

Bite him, Gizmo!

Uhm, sorry. Got carried away.

 

Free feed is necessary at this point. Like they say, forget the rules, just do anything to get him eating.

 

Liz, have you eaten anything?

 

I had breakfast and just now a couple of chips . My stomach is in such knots it doesn't matter at this point.

He finished the Meow Mix (all but a tiny bite) so I opened a can of FF T&G and gave him a tablespoon, which he ate. Put the rest of the 3oz can between two bowls and am going to leave them out overnight (added a bit of water to keep it from drying out). Set an alarm for midnight to check on him and then up at 4a to start the nightmare all over again.

Going to test now and then headed to the blow up mattess in the den.

 

Hope tomorrow is a better day

 

Ok. stomach knots obviate food. Chips are good though. Get as much sleep as you can. hugs for all three of you.

 

The Standard Process are glandular extracts. Several kinds of formulations, that either focus on specific organs, functions, or whole body support. Ones that came to mind while reading yours about Gizmo: pancreatrophin, Renafood or their feline variation: feline renal support, and feline whole body support.

If your vet is familiar with or amenable to including alternative supports in regimen or if you have access to homeopathic or herbal vet, might be worth asking him/her about glandular supports. The products are also available through Amazon if vet doesn’t carry them.