? Increased dose triggers NDW?

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fearlessmom

fearlessmom

Member Since 2017
Fearless is bouncing again, but this time off higher BG numbers than before. I tried front-loading food and he stayed in blues and yellows for the most part, but only for 3 cycles, and now it appears he's bounced off yesterday's 106. o_O He's been on 1U for 2 wks. Increase now or wait?
 
Hey there. Just looking at the SS and wondering why you didn't reduce after the 48 on 5/23 AM cycle .

He could be bouncing off the 106 and with meter variance +/- that could have been a green but, even without the meter variance it was the lowest number he saw since 5.23 Last night, he had a big drop from PMBG to +2. That didn't help the bounce. I would hold until the bounce clears.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Yes, you can increase during bounce. you just don't want to increase on the cycle when they are breaking a bounce because the downward momentum ofnthatncyclemplus an increase can be too exciting. Check out post #17 on this thread. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...ging-protocols-good-idea.111088/#post-1250113

Can you remind me again why you didn't decrease after that 48 on the 23rd?
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But how do you know if you increase during a bounce that she won't break the bounce that cycle?
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
sort of figured that you might have shot through the bounce that night but, did not give the reduction the next cycle.
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Maybe it was because of this reply:
Well, he's earned a reduction back to .75u tonight.
Karen's correct, but considering the greens have been few and far between as well as surrounded by such high numbers AND given as much as you test and the fact that his numbers were brought up very easily, I'd hold the dose while using food to manipulate the curve. However, the decision is yours.
 
fearlessmom said:
Maybe it was because of this reply:
Well, he's earned a reduction back to .75u tonight.
Karen's correct, but considering the greens have been few and far between as well as surrounded by such high numbers AND given as much as you test and the fact that his numbers were brought up very easily, I'd hold the dose while using food to manipulate the curve. However, the decision is yours.
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Okay, I remember that now from Jill.
 
Libby and Lucy said:
The reason we are holding doses for 8-10 cycles when a cat is new to blue, and again when they are new to green, is because we want to see if this current dose might be the one that causes a breakthrough.

Let's say your cat hits a nadir of 80 then he bounces. 80 isn't bad, let's see if he can do it again. Hold the dose until that bounce clears, usually 2-3 days. If the bounce clears and he hits a nadir of 80 again, great! That's a good nadir for now, let's see if he can do it again. I would hold the dose again and see what happens. If that bounce clears and his nadir is, for example, 110, then 110 is ok but could be better. There's really no reason to wait around (we are looking for Tight Regulation, after all). If this dose isn't getting him back to good nadirs after a total of 8-10 cycles, it's time for the next dose. There are some cats who might need a couple of extra cycles, but for the most part if a dose isn't working then there is no reason to hold it longer than 8-10 cycles. If the dose IS working, then hold it as long as you can!
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If this is the info Wendy was referring to, I hadn't seen it before. Fearless is fairly new to the kind of blue streak he was on the last two days, but once he dropped out of the blues, I should have increased this morning, right?
 
Libby and Lucy said:
Every high number is not a bounce! Numbers go down, numbers go up. Often I see people comment that their cat is bouncing, when really they are just seeing the natural rise at the end of the cycle or a food spike. Other times I see people whose cats are stuck (really stuck) in a high pattern who think it's a bounce. If your cat has been in pretty good numbers for a while, then suddenly loses regulation, don't hold the dose, get the regulation back! If they are used to good numbers, it is much, much easier to get the good numbers back if you do it quickly.
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I often wonder if what I am seeing in Fearless is a real bounce or just higher numbers. Maybe today was one of those cases? Now that we know his PMPS is lower than the rest of the day was, can I assume he is clearing the bounce (if it was one) and/or that we will see an active cycle (such as on 5/8 pm)?
 
It appears to me that he's clearing the bounce so you wouldn't want to increase this cycle.


ETA. what helped me with discerning bounces are that they wobble around whereas failed reductions go steadily upwards.
 
Still waiting for onset. Now it doesn't look like it will be an active cycle. Increase to 1.25u tomorrow? Or wait another day (since his bounces average 5 cycles)?
 
fearlessmom said:
Still waiting for onset. Now it doesn't look like it will be an active cycle. Increase to 1.25u tomorrow? Or wait another day (since his bounces average 5 cycles)?
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That was one flat yellow cycle last night which could indicate the next cycle will be lower. See where he is for his AMBG before you decide to increase.
 
Mid-yellow. He could go lower today but since his bounces are usually 5 cycles (which means 2 more are to come), and I have to shoot by 7:30 am my time (CST), I'll stick with the 1u for now.
 
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So after flat high blues/low yellows yesterday, I increased the dose this morning. No movement thus far; in fact, no blue in sight. But not really a big increase either (esp. considering +/-20%), so would you call this NDW?
 
It can take a few cycles for the new dose depot to fill in. Right now, he is looking still fairly flat. NDW usually happens on the 2nd cycle. Let's see what he can do with this new dose.
 
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