Sam - Month 10

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by Djamila, Nov 5, 2017.

  1. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Linking to the thread in the the Health Forum so I don't lose it:
    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/pancreatitis-with-no-symptoms.186289/

    Starting the tenth month since Sam came out of remission. :(

    Yesterday he started cerenia to see if it can help with the probable pancreatitis. I don't know if it's making him feel better, but he was sure hungry for breakfast! And despite my best efforts at explaining, he was not quite understanding that I was trying to take that extra hour of sleep this morning and kept patting my face to wake me up. At 3:30am! (normal wake up is 4:30 - how are cats so incredibly accurate with telling time?!?!?)

    When I refused to get up, he started patting my face with his sharp little claws extended. THAT got my attention! It also earned him an early morning nail trimming!

    He's been really starting to dig into the raw chicken wings laced with fortiflora. He still doesn't seem to like the bones, but he's purring while he gnaws on the meat and seems pretty happy with it. And I'm happy that it's helping his teeth without me having to brush them!

    He's also turning his nose up at the canned food right now, so I'm starting to consider making his food. It would be a lot cheaper than buying the raw food at the fancy little pet store. I just ordered a sample of the foodfurlife supplement, so I figure I'll give it a whirl and see if he takes to it.

    I hope you all survived the full moon and everyone is well!
     
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  2. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Well, six days into the cerenia, and I thought he was doing well, but this morning he was fussing - walking around meowing in that upset tone that he has, and sure enough....liquipoo! :confused::( Poor baby! It was making him feel so lousy that I couldn't get him to take any SEB. I left him alone for a few hours, and he did finally eat it. It's making me think that maybe I should get some of those pill capsule thingys so I can pill him when he's too sick to want to eat.

    I did get a ketone test in which was negative, but not feeling well + his numbers lately has me more than a little nervous about that, especially going into a weekend. Please send some healing vines his way.
     
  3. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    A multitude of healing vines on the way, Djamila. Poor Sam and poor you. Sounds like it could be an IBD flare. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  4. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Djamila,

    Here is hoping Sam is going to feel better soon. I was glad to see your post, but not that Sam is not well. He seemed to be the only kitty around who did not get sick when Buddy was on Prozinc. Maybe it will not last much longer. I will send healing vines to Sam.

    I lost one of my kitty's on Wednesday, Red was her name and she had been with me for 16 years. I did not want to lose her, but I did not want her to continue suffering. Guess all pet owners go through this at some time.
     
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  5. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Djamila, sending tons and tons of healing vines to you and Sam!
     
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  6. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    I'm so sorry you lost your kitty, Red, Teresa. I know you take really good care of all of them. I hope Buddy is doing OK. :bighug:
     
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  7. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oh, @Teresa & Buddy! I'm so sorry you had to say good-bye to one of your fur babies! I'm certain you made the most loving decision for her, and wish you peace in letting her go.

    @Kris & Teasel, I'm pretty sure you're right about the IBD. He just can't catch a break these days.

    Last night when he was pawing at the cerenia box I just thought it was cute, but in hindsight, I think he was probably not feeling well.

    I limited his food to just plain bland things (chicken, baby food) today to rest his belly, not that he cared since he wasn't hungry anyway. But tonight at dinner time he was super hungry and refused the baby food, so I gave him some of his regular Primal Chicken. Hopefully it will be okay. I'm glad he had a good appetite again at least!
     
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  8. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. I'm sorry too. Buddy, I am afraid to say anything, but he has been doing better since he started taking Hemp.
    How are your fur babies. Is Teasel OTJ.
     
  9. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    I did not know Sam had pancreatitis, when did this start. Hope it gets better.
     
  10. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    No, Teasel isn’t off the juice, Teresa. I switched him to Levemir in September. He still bounces but he feels a lot better than he did on Lantus. I doubt if remission is in the cards and I’m OK with that. :)
     
  11. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    No overnight pooping. (Oh, the things we talk about around here!) But he's clearly not feeling well. He ate breakfast and morning snack with his usual appetite, but he's lying flopped sideways on the floor, and occasionally lifts his head and gives me sad eyes. Still negative on ketones this morning. He's probably getting tired of me following him to the LB so often these days. When I sit down, he wants snuggles which he only does when he's sick. And Atticus is hissing at him (also common when Sam is sick).

    Put in an early morning call to the vet who only suggested another round of metronidazole. I like my vet, but I'm starting to think a second opinion is in order. It may be nothing more than an IBD flare, but I can't help but worry over him these days. I know the vet would run whatever test I tell him to run, but right now, I don't even know what to ask for, and don't want to put Sam through unnecessary stress by just asking for random things. Hopefully it's just his usual belly problems and another day or two will have him on the mend.

    I finally got brave enough to give the B12 injection this morning, hoping that maybe it will give him a little boost. The needle is so big that I've been hesitating, but he took it like a champ. Please keep the vines coming.
     
  12. Caitlin M

    Caitlin M Well-Known Member

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    So much love and support! :bighug:
     
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  13. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Sending more good vines, Djamila. I hope he turns a corner soon.
     
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  14. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    I remember reading a post of yours and Teasel had wonderful numbers, glad he is feeling better.
     
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  15. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Hi Djamila,

    Sorry that Sam is not feeling well. Buddy takes metronidazole a lot, one of my other kitty's with tentative IBD also takes a lot of metronidazole.
    Just wanted to let you know that other vet's do the same thing as your vet.
     
  16. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Thank you, Teresa. I just get nervous about any of us (humans or cats) taking antibiotics very often. He was just on it about a month ago. I also don't love having to pill him. He's pretty good about it, but he sure doesn't enjoy it!

    I have a question for you about cerenia: he's taking 1/4 tablet once/day. I believe some kitties take 1/2 tablet, so would it be okay to give him 1/4 tablet twice/day when he isn't feeling well? Or is that a no-no to give it twice in 24 hours?

    Also, what hemp product are you giving Buddy? I wonder if that might be something we should try.
     
  17. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    some people find curcumin (tumeric derivative) is helpful for IBD cats. It's got anti inflammatory properties.
     
  18. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    I have been told by Buddy's vet that I could give 2 - 1/4 tablet of cerenia in hrs. At this time Buddy is taking Hemp, sometimes he will need metronidazole, he is taking Rx Vitamins for PETS HempRx SoftChews For Cats, Formulated By Robert J. Silver, DVM, MS,CVA. I bought Buddy's from his vet, but it can be bought on line. You should not give anymore than 2 a day. Buddy would not eat them so I broke off a piece put it in his pull pusher and he took it. My biggest problem is he wants to eat all the time and is putting on weight. He was taking pain meds, appetite stimulants and Ondansetron and or Cerenia.

    No my biggest problem is trying to get his insulin under control and his BG down.
     
  19. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    You might want to check on line CW hemp oil, also Bud takes B12 injections and I do not use the syringes the vet sent with it. I buy from Walmart ReliOn Insulin Syringes 1ml, 31gauge, 8mm to use for B12 injections.
     
  20. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I like that idea! So if his dose is 0.25 on the giant syringes, how much do you give him on an insulin syringe?
     
  21. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Increased to 3u today, and got a +3 of 110. I really had my hopes up that he might hit a green, but at +6.5, he was already rising a bit. Silver lining: he has had a nice long surf in healthier numbers today. It's a big dose for my little guy, but I can breathe a little easier when he's spending more time in non-damaging numbers like this.
     
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  22. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Buddy takes 1cc so I had to get a larger syringe than I use for his Lantus. The giant syringes they sent home with me were 3 cc/ml, I don't know what size you have.
     
  23. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Ah, that makes sense. Thank you!
     
  24. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Last night Sam gave me a lower-than-normal pre-shot. I didn't have time to stall, so I decided to trust his numbers lately and went ahead and gave him the full dose. It gave me butterflies, but I knew I'd be home in a couple of hours and could keep an eye on him the rest of the cycle. His usual nadir is around +3, and he surfed from +3 to +4 so I left food out for him just in case, and went to sleep. I was so happy to see him get some hours in those healthy green numbers. But then of course I gave him a fur shot this morning. $%#@! His numbers held steady through the day though which surprised me. He should have spiked into at least the high yellows, but he ended up by giving a high blue PS. Between the low PS last night, the lower nadir, and the steady numbers today, I gave him a slight reduction. Time will tell if that was the right decision or not. I can always bring him back up if it doesn't hold.

    Also, I got my sample from foodfurlife.com and made the first batch of food. Sam loved it. Atticus wouldn't even taste it. Oh, these cats!
     
  25. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    @Teresa & Buddy, do you know if cerenia can be used longer term? Sam is done with what the vet gave him, but just now I noticed he's sitting meatloaf style again, which he had stopped doing when he was taking the cerenia. His appetite and everything are still fine, but I'm wondering if I should ask the vet for more, or if it is only supposed to be used occasionally?
     
  26. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    I would ask the vet for more, you never know when you might run into a problem. Most always I have some cerenia here, when ever I ask for it they always will sell me some. I do know some people use it long term.
     
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  27. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Happy Saturday, everyone! Sam's energy and appetite have been great the past couple of days, and he isn't flopping on the floor as much, so I'm hoping that means his legs are feeling better too. His numbers have been settling down a smidge too, so it looks like we're in a good dose range for now. I reduced a bit on the evening dose since the PS-to-nadir was rather steep and it was sticking him in higher numbers for the AM cycles. The result was a blue PS this morning which was nice to see. Waiting to see if he actually gets a curve this morning instead of staying flat like he's been the last few AM cycles. He may need to go back up in a few days, but my theory is that a gentler curve will help to get better balance between the AM and PM cycles while he re-adjusts to being in the greens.

    He's still working on adjusting to the FoodFurLife raw food. He seems to like gnawing on the pieces of meat until the coating is off of them, and then he leaves them. He's eating about half and just gnawing on the other half. He's still only getting a half dozen pieces/meal at this point.

    Since the main reason I'm trying this was to get him to "brush his teeth" by gnawing on raw meat chunks, I figure he's really doing that, even if he doesn't start using this as a primary food source.

    The biggest problem is that he seems to want to take them out of the dish, walk somewhere, gnaw on it, and then just leave the raw meat sitting on the floor. :eek::stop: Not okay! Super gross! This morning I put a washcloth on the floor a few feet away from the dish hoping he would use that as his eating place instead of just walking to some random spot on the rug, and it seemed to work. He took his meat over there to chew it. Fingers crossed that can be our compromise. It is just not nice to step on a chunk of raw meat sitting on the carpet! Not to mention the health hazard. Why are kitties so gross sometimes!?!?!? :cat::confused::cat::confused:
     
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  28. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Great news, Djamila! :D
     
  29. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    He is a man, what did you expect from a man.
     
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  30. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Lol...hmmm...you may have a point there!

    And no luck on the better curve today. He's still flat. Sigh. Patience....patience....patience....

    On the bright side, it's a whole lot better than those pinks and reds he was getting a few weeks ago!
     
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  31. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Lol at least he used the washcloth! My cats would probably put it RIGHT NEXT to the washcloth and walk off...
     
  32. Teresa & Buddy

    Teresa & Buddy Well-Known Member

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    Mine would too. They put their dry food in their mouth and then put it on the floor, then eat off the floor leaving food everywhere.
     
  33. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    HA! My Oreo loves to grab wet food in his mouth, then chomp on it while looking around. He ends up with food scattered ALL around the bowl on the floor...but he just can't bear to miss something fun that might be going on while he eats!
     
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  34. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    And why do they want to barf on carpet when a bare floor is inches away? Or position their backside just over the edge to the outside of the litter box to pee? Luckily mine are fastidious eaters at least. My friend's cat has his food dish near a wall and he sprays bits of food all over the wall as he eats.
     
  35. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    LOL...this conversation is cracking me up! I'm so glad it's not just my weird kitties!

    Sam is at 108 for his PMPS. Which means I have to stall. I am very very bad at stalling. And very very bad at making him go through extra tests. Two tests in 30 minutes is going to be rough on both of us. And it's raining. But I'm going for a walk anyway because there is no way I can stall and stay in the house at the same time. He's already meowing and trying to eat my hair and looking at me with perplexed little eyes. (yes, I know I'm a total baby about this stuff!) :) Bye-bye! Be back in a little bit!
     
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  36. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Take that walk! You can always shower too...but I found a walk better since they follow us into the shower and really, being out of the house is just better. Besides, a walk in the rain could be fun! Looking forward to seeing what Sam does tonight (though I probably won't be around...I was out late last night and I'm officially too old to be out late LOL).
     
  37. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    108 @+40min. So that didn't help at all. Ugh. I think I'm going to feed and let the food bring him up. It's a riskier that way - shooting on an inflated number - but if it works, I should be able to give him something at least. I just hate the idea of him going all cycle with no insulin. I never thought I'd be wishing for a food spike! :cool:
     
  38. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    When Teasel was on ProZinc and gave me a low PS I'd quite often feed him, wait 45 minutes, retest and then give him a (usually) slightly lower dose. Never had a problem doing that.
     
  39. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I gave him 2u (instead of 2.6) at +1.5. He was still a little low, but since it's less insulin I think he should be fine. As always around here, time will tell...
     
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  40. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Well, looks like the 2u on the PM cycle might have been a smidge much for him. He only got down to 51, so still safe, but he was stuffing his face and drinking a ton of water to steer himself. He ate the entire night's worth of food during that hour. I find a lot of comfort in seeing him take care of it when he gets into those lower numbers. It helps me not be too afraid when I am gone all day. I'll admit it was hard not to intervene. I just kept reminding myself that he was still safe, and that adding carbs would mess him up unnecessarily. I did put out some more regular low-carb food when he ran out, in part because Atticus hadn't had the chance to eat anything!

    I'm not sure what to make of yesterday's cycles. The AM cycle went really long (and has gone long a few other times recently) which can sometimes mean they don't need quite that much insulin, and on just 2u he went about as low as we like to see around here. I gave him a pretty large reduction today (down to 2u on an AM cycle) even though he'll likely stay high today after last night's numbers. I think during the AM cycle, he could handle more than that, but I'm trying to keep the AM/PM cycle about equal until we're in more of a fine tuning phase. And it looks like that PM cycle is being pretty responsive lately since 2u was just on the edge of being too much last night.

    So all that to say that I have no idea what music he's dancing to this week, but it looks like the tune has changed from the slow waltz of the last few weeks.

    I'm looking forward to the upcoming long weekend (Thanksgiving in the US) to try to figure out the steps to this new dance.

    Happy Monday to everyone! I hope you all have a good day!
     
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  41. Beenie

    Beenie Well-Known Member

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    Looking like some sort of Cha-Cha:p

    Glad to see those greens:D
     
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  42. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Or maybe a Quick Step!

    He's done it again, though not as low as last night. But he's at 147. Last night he was at 150 and 2 units was cutting it close. 1.75? 1.5? I think I'm going to go with 1.5 to give his ears a break. He was dehydrated last night, so a few of those tests took more than one poke. I think he would appreciate a few less tests tonight (and I would appreciate a better sleep). And the 147 is food inflated because he tore open the Primal Freeze Dried Turkey bag and I came home to find him gorging himself on it. Which also makes me wonder if the 2u today might have been too much. Plus, he's acting WILD tonight, so trying to get him to hold still every hour might be a bit more than he can handle. Based on the mischief level, it looks like he's feeling better again! :smuggrin:
     
  43. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Why, that little devil is feeling good! :D
     
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  44. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Yes, although eating freeze-dried food without adding water first is worse for hydration than kibble! I fed him Friskies and added a ton of water for dinner tonight, so hopefully it will replenish at least a little.
     
  45. Beenie

    Beenie Well-Known Member

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    So glad to hear Sam is feeling good!!!!:):)

    Happy Thanksgiving!!!!
     
  46. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Happy Thanksgiving to you and Ming and Buddy and DH! I hope you all have a great day today!

    Sam seems to have rallied a bit from his malaise of this past phase of his journey. Not sure if it's getting over the pancreatitis (yeah, cerenia!), having a boost from the B12 shots, or getting back to his preferred insulin (or a combined effect of all three), but he definitely has more spring in his step and is getting into all kinds of mischief again.

    I'm really pleased that he's been able to lower his dose a bit in the past week, and it's been nice to see him spending more time in healthy numbers again. Plus, his leg strength seems to be back since he's again jumping and running all over the place. Atticus, who has always had a bit more of a regal demeanor, would prefer that Sam settle back down into a more dignified middle age, but I'm enjoying the return of his joie de vivre.

    Happy Thanksgiving to everyone here from the US, and Happy Thursday to our international members! I'm thankful for all of you being a part of this crazy little community!
     
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  47. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hooray for daytime GREEN!!! :D:D:D

    It's barely green, but I'll take it!
     
  48. Beenie

    Beenie Well-Known Member

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    :D nothing like greenies during the day:joyful:

    Slowly Sam o_O
     
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  49. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Why is it that they always go low right when the bean has to leave the house? Is he going up or down from here? He's never been one to dive. He usually surfs along in safe numbers. He has food. He just got himself a good sized snack. I have almost a year of data to say he's going to be fine. And yet I'm still having trouble getting my shoes on and leaving him.
     
  50. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    What?! This is what Teasel does, not Sam! :eek:
     
  51. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Well, I couldn't get myself to leave without knowing what he was doing, so I hung out and did a second test 45 minutes later. Surfing as usual. And then I was late. I wish I would stop being such a worry wart! He's proven over and over how he responds, but somehow I think that the one time I don't double check is the time he's going to do something weird. Thankfully it was an understanding friend who was willing to push breakfast back a little, but I feel awful asking people to re-arrange their schedules like that.
     
  52. W.K.

    W.K. Member

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    Feb 16, 2017
    I think we all feel this way, no matter what our data says.
    Nice numbers Sam!!
     
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  53. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Sam's internal clock has been off a bit this week. Our normal t/f/s time is 4:20ish, but he keeps waking me up at 3:30. I've been careful to ignore him to try to get his clock re-set for the right time, but this morning he went beyond the usual meowing and pawing at my face and bit me! Hard enough to break skin even. Little bugger. So then I had to get up and clean it and put on some antibiotic ointment.

    He has a feeder that opens at +9, and there was still leftover food in his dish, so it's not like he was starving.

    I don't know what to do to get him back on schedule. Any suggestions?
     

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