Starting Edward on Lantus tomorrow (Friday)

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by SnowKat, Jan 16, 2020.

  1. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2020
    Hi everyone! Super anxious sugarcat mama here. I am picking up the insulin and syringes today to start my boy on his path to healing tomorrow morning. I have read everything about feline diabetes that I can find, since he was diagnosed last week, and I've been home monitoring here and there over the last week as well. Edward's BG seems to bottom out in the 230s before eating, and gets up around 300 after eating. He has been up to 330 at the vet's office. My vet recommended starting him at 1 unit of Lantus twice a day. Does that sound like a reasonable starting dose? Of course I fear the hypo possibility (I do have a kit ready). I will be testing his BG before shots... at least, I will be *attempting* to test (I don't always have luck drawing enough blood). Also, if he doesn't eat at the same time as the dose, that should be OK with Lantus, right? Sometimes he is just too lazy to eat. He's always been a grazer (I free-feed, with fresh wet food put down twice a day). I guess I'm just looking for reassurance. Thank you.
     
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  2. Mo & Colby

    Mo & Colby Member

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    Jan 16, 2020
    Hi there! I have no words of wisdom as I am just two days behind you on this journey. So I am following this thread to offer my moral support and to learn as well.
    Clearly I need to start a spreadsheet. And no clue how to go about it. No clue how to do any of this! But will learn.

    Good luck with the Lantus! Hoping it’s the answer!
     
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  3. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Hello @Mo & Colby,and welcome! We've definitely found the right place. I have learned more here than I ever would have teased out of my vet or pharmacist. Here is a link to the spreadsheet. It's pretty self-explanatory. Good luck to us both, and all the others out there on the same journey <3
     
  4. Sue and Luci

    Sue and Luci Well-Known Member

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    Nov 3, 2017
    Hi Snowkat! Be sure to join us over on the Lantus, Levemir and Basaglar forum when you start Lantus - that group specifically addresses all Lantus users and can best support you as you learn all the tricks of this game :)
     
  5. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Thank you, @Sue and Luci. Should I move this post over there?
     
  6. Sue and Luci

    Sue and Luci Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2017
    You don't have to move the post over - however the first post over there should contain the url for this post copy/paste it as the first line of your comments - as a historical reference to the previous day.

    We do that every day - so that visitors to our condos can see the last post. I usually use the little chain link that's in the tab line above where you're going to write to copy/paste the hyperlink from my previous day's post into the day of the week; So when you click on 'Wednesday' from the post I created this morning you can go back to my previous post to see what I said the day before - it just gives continuity to our threads for reference for those reading and providing advice/support.

    Looks like your SS is all set up and ready to go as well as your signature - nice job!

    Just post tomorrow with the format we all use: Date / Cat Name / AMPS ### - follow with comment that you're new and introduce yourself briefly to the group. It's always good to see new faces and welcome to you and your floofy boy :)

    I'll be looking forward to reading your post tomorrow.
     
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  7. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009

    Hiya

    1 Unit of Lantus twice a day is a normal Start Low, Go Slow start dose.

    When you do the insulin start bg tests, you should follow the respons to the insulin with a bg curve like this

    A.m pre-insulin shot

    +3 hours after a.m insulin

    + 6 hours after a.m insulin

    +9 hours after a.m insulin

    +12 hours p.m pre-insulin shot


    So you get off at a good start.
     
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  8. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    Hello and welcome. Could you put in a couple of the blood sugar values in your spreadsheet from your testing without insulin. They might be of interest.

    There are two dosing methods we use here for Lantus. if you pop over to the Lantus forum, read the Sticky Notes on the top of the forum, including the on dosing methods. If you are feeding all low carb wet or raw, you can follow either method. Pick the one that suits your life style. One method, Start Low Go Slow or SLGS has a starting dose of 0.5 units for an all low carb diet. The other, Tight Regulation, or TR, has a weight based formula, that often works out to about 1 units as a starting dose. I see you have entered SLGS in your signature. Did you vet suggest why the starting dose of 1 unit?

    As for eating, onset with Lantus is 2-3 hours after the shot, so he doesn't have to eat right away. And it's OK if he grazes or does mini meals, a Lantus is a gentle insulin. You do want him to eat some food before onset.
     
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  9. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    How are you and Edward doing today?
     
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  10. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    @Ann & Scatcats thank you for asking! We are actually doing awesome so far! I got a solid BG result with one prick, he ate some food, and I got the insulin shot done without even a flinch. My only concern is that I hope it wasn’t a fur shot... the needle is so short and the dose so small and his fur so thick, that it almost seemed like nothing happened, LOL. But I didn’t see any wetness, so I’m hoping it got in him. I’m testing him in about a half hour to see where his BG is at.
     
  11. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    Glad to hear you are doing awesome so far.

    I tell you what, fur shots do happen even if you done it twice every day for 6 years as I have. Also almost shooting myself with the needle, and plenty of bg testing on myself. That's like been the really fun bonding part with Simba, his silly mama.
    In the very beginning I also almost fainted as I gave him his insulin, since I had always in my life had a severe needle fright.
     
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  12. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Woot woot! It definitely was not a fur shot - his BG has come down from AMPS @ 286 to +3 @ 212! Oh my gosh I think we can do this!!!!!
     
  13. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    Of course you can!
     
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  14. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Go Edward and Snowkat!

    "Depot" with lantus will take about 6 cycles to fill.
    • Lantus smells like bandaids.
    • You can shave a small patch of fur on Edward to help you see where you are shooting the insulin.
    • Wherever you decide to inject the insulin. Shoulder area, flanks, towards belly, scruff.
    • Long haired and thick haired kitties have unique challenges.
    • Do you tent the skin up a bit and part the fur for the shot? That is another technique.
    • Or the wrist-roll method for giving the shot.
    • Some people say the wrist-roll method can cut down on the number of fur shots.
    Testing and Shooting Tips for you. With explanation of "tenting" and "rolling" injection methods.

    Go Edward!!!!!

    p.s. Lots of good links in the Health Links / FAQs about Feline Diabetes forum. Look in the Index Sticky at the top.
    From Deb the "Reference Librarian" (just kidding)
     
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  15. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Awesome tips - thank you @Deb & Wink! I used the tent method on his scruff. His fur is extremely thick and long, so shaving might be really helpful.

    So I just tested again at +6 and he is 140!! Wow, I knew it would work but this is so exciting to see!

    Question: so with Lantus, would +6 be considered the nadir of BG in a 12 hr cycle? I have to leave the house and won’t be able to re-test him at +9. Next test will be PMPS just before his evening shot.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2020
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  16. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    Are you out of the house by then or could you test him at +7 to get the right nadir?

    If I had lived there I'd offer to baby sit him while you are away.
     
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  17. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Great idea - I can definitely test at +7 right before I leave. You are very kind to offer that! I can’t imagine he’d go much lower than +6?? I mean, what are the chances that he could go hypo on his first 1 unit dose? I’m telling myself not to worry, but now I’m starting to worry... sigh.
     
  18. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    He will be fine. I just wanted the +7 then so we can see were his nadir is and how long his good 140 last since at +9 it is more likely that his bg's start to go up.
     
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  19. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Gotcha! I will do my darnedest to get a decent blood drop at +7! (I seem to notice that I tend to get blood easier early in the day and it gets harder as we get closer to evening.) Thank you kindly for following our first day and offering such great suggestions and support
     
  20. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    Give Edward a big and long hug for being sucha Champ for his very first day! The two of you have done a great and successful job together today. I hope you feel more empowered.

    That's what our jobs are here, to guide and help.
     
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  21. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Just retested at +7... 108. Jeez I hope he doesn’t keep falling...
     
  22. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    Seeing that I am glad I asked for that +7 bg. I however doubt he falls down to under 50.
     
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  23. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    Jan 31, 2013
    Leave some food out for Edward. Cats will often seek out food if they feel their BG levels falling.
     
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  24. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    I left food out and gave him some freeze dried protein treats (his favorite). Needless to say, I will be making this outing as brief as possible. Should be home in 2.5 hours. Will retest as soon as I get home. Thank you, @Ann & Scatcats and @Deb & Wink
     
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  25. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    FINALLY back home after this snowstorm. Edward is +11 @ 125. He is due for another unit in a hour. ???
     
  26. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Ok so we are at 144 at +12, time of next shot. I am extremely hesitant to shoot another full unit right now, but I don’t have enough experience to make finer adjustments. I am going to error on safety and hold off tonight, and see where he’s at tomorrow at +24 after his first shot. I hope I’m making the right decision and don’t set him back. Ugh
     
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  27. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    You made the right choice of not giving insulin on a 144 +12. We don't risk his safety.

    You can reduce the insulin dose to 0.5 Unit twice a day and see what numbers he get then.
     
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  28. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
  29. Ann & Scatcats

    Ann & Scatcats Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    How have Edward and you been doing today?

    What was Edward's morning a.m Bg number this morning?

    Hope you both got some sleep.
     
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  30. SnowKat

    SnowKat Member

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    Jan 11, 2020
    Hi @Ann & Scatcats , we are doing pretty good! He was at 289 this morning, and his numbers haven’t dropped as quickly today as they did yesterday. I have been reading up on Lantus dosing and I am ready to shoot the full 1u tonight, assuming everything looks normal.

    Feel free to check out my new thread!
     
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  31. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    Jan 31, 2013
    Hang on Snowkat. Lantus depot takes about 3 days or 6 cycles to fill the "depot". I'd suggest your wait a few days.

    Hold steady on the lower dose for now. Steady as she goes.

    p.s. See my comment on her other thread, over in the lantus forum.
     
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  32. Mo & Colby

    Mo & Colby Member

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    Jan 16, 2020
    Lurking here and loving all this great support and info!
     
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  33. Sue and Luci

    Sue and Luci Well-Known Member

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    Nov 3, 2017
    Mo is adorable! Welcome to the LB&L Forum! Hope you'll post soon so we can get to know you and Mo. :bighug:
     
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