Stressed Kitty Mom

Discussion in 'Welcome to the Group - Post an Introduction Here' started by Walker's Mom, Aug 27, 2015.

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  1. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    I found out my cat is diabetic on August 3. He is on Novelin N and I just got my glucometer and started checking him on a daily basis. I feed him Fancy Feast grilled morning and night and leave some Royal Canine SO in his bowl during the day for his urinary tract health and in case his blood sugar drops while I am at work he has something to eat.

    The past few days his blood sugar has been getting higher and higher. Vet told me to increase his insulin to 3 units. However the last time I did he started hiding behind the dryer and isolating in general. Not sure what is going on. This is all new to me. I love this cat so much and I feel like I don't know what I am doing. I appreciate any guidance you guys can provide.
     
  2. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Hi and welcome to FDMB.

    You're on the right track for getting your meter and home testing. What has Walker's BG (blood glucose) numbers been at home?

    Fancy Feast grilled are too high in carbs. You need to look for canned/wet food under 10%. A good choice would be Fancy Feast Classics unless Walker has kidney issues. If so, then you'd want to find a food lower in phosphorus as well. See this chart for carb and phosphorus values: http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

    Royal Canin SO (lower on the list under Prescription Diets) is also very high in carbs and not good for sugar cats.

    Transition Walker slowly from high carb to low carb food since he is already on insulin. Otherwise, you may see a very dangerous drop in BG #'s.

    How is Walker's weight? If he needs to lose weight, a timed feeder can be helpful.

    Please also read the links in this helpful guide. It discusses urinary tract issues, too. Also note the links in the right-hand column. They are very helpful: http://www.catinfo.org/

    Novolin is a fast acting, short acting and harsh insulin. At most, Walker may be getting up to 8 hours of benefit. Few cats are on Novolin; most here are on longer lasting, more gentler insulins such as Lantus or Prozinc.

    3 units of Novolin is quite high.

    Please read this primer on Novolin (Humulin is the same as Novolin, just different manufacturers):
    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/vetsulin-caninsulin-humulin-n.19/

    Also print or keep BJM's handy glucometer guide handy. You'll need it in case Walker goes hypo: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oI_34_EgqeKdpyttFW0oLoG1mbw16IkATAWHhoQD2JU/pub

    Be sure to have on hand some honey, karo syrup or high carb gravy food on hand in case Walker goes hypo. With Novolin, that is quite possible. CJ went hypo Novolin.

    Glad you found us. It will get easier!
     
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  3. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Walker's glucose has been steadily going up. Been testing him right before meals and tonight it was at 592. My vet suggested Novolin because it was $25 at Walmart. How much are Lantus and Prozinc and do I need a Rx?

    His weight is a little low. He is at 10.15 lbs. Vet recommends that he be 12lbs.

    Is there any food that can be left out that is low in carbs in case his blood sugar drops while I am away at work?

    Thank you so much for taking the time to respond and all of the links!!
     
  4. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Novolin may be cheap but overall it's not a good insulin for a cat because it wears off long before 12 hours and can cause BG to bounce high and low. 592 is very high. Are you testing for ketones? If not, I strongly urge you to buy ketones strips. Walmart sells them.

    Info about ketones: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...oacidosis-dka-and-blood-ketone-meters.135952/

    Lantus and Prozic require RXs. You can check the For Sale section in this forum to see if anyone is selling a Lantus pen or vial or Prozinc. You wouldn't need an RX to buy from a private party.

    Mark's Pharmacy, one used by many members here, sells 5 pens of Lantus for a very good price. You'll need to check to see if they are taking new patients. You may need to sign up for their waiting list: https://rxcanada4less.com/search.php They contacted me recently and said Lantus were back in stock so hopefully that will apply to you too.

    @granadilla what was the name of the online site where you bought Prozinc?
    @pevsfreedom, what was the name of the site where you bought Lantus?

    Stella & Chewy's is a low carb choice many of us leave out for our sugar cats. The carbs aren't shown in the chart but so far no one has reported an increase in BG levels with it. If you do buy it, be sure to check and make sure the product is not on the recall list: http://www.stellaandchewys.com/stella-chewys-recall-notice/

    Some of the low carb kitten food in the chart I gave you may have higher calories and may help with the weight loss.
     
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  5. granadilla

    granadilla Well-Known Member

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    Jun 13, 2015
    I bought Prozinc at ValleyVet.com. It was $95 for a vial that lasts about 3-4 months, depending on the dosage. A vet will need to call or fax in a scrip, then they ship it overnight (for free) with cold packs. Prozinc requires U40 syringes but you can use the U100 syringes as long as you use the conversion chart: http://www.felinediabetes.com/insulin-conversions-printer.htm

    What is Walker's BG at the lowest point between injections (that's called the "nadir")? The nadir is typically around the middle of the cycle. It could be anywhere from +3 hours after the shot to sometime later like +7. It could be that he is getting too much insulin.

    @BJM can you explain how too much insulin can look like too little? You gave a good explanation to heyHollis.
     
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  6. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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  7. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    Oct 6, 2010
    A term you'll learn well using Novolin NPH is bouncing. Bouncing happens when the glucose a) drops too low, or b) drops very fast, or c) drops to an unfamiliar level. This causes hormones to release stored glucose (glycogen) which raises the glucose level back up, higher than before, for around 3 days.
    If you test around the nadir for NPH - about +3 to +4 hours after the shot - you'll see about how low the glucose has dropped and this may give you the explanation for later high numbers.
     
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  8. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    I just tested Walker's blood sugar and it is 592 before breakfast. My vet just called to check on my kitty and I told him the number. He said to give him 3 units in the morning and 4 at night. I said I was concerned that we should switch to a new insulin. He said it was still too soon to tell and if he is insulin resistant nothing would help him. The interesting thing is my cat was acting healthier than I have seen him act in awhile. He was playing with me and seemed energetic. I am so confused!
     
  9. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    (@Elizabeth and Bertie, @BJM, @Sue and Oliver (GA) - If you're online can you review this post and comment if there's anything you disagree with, please?)


    Welcome, Walker and Mom. (What's your name? :) )

    We often see cats here who have been prescribed too much insulin to start with, or whose doses have been increased too quickly. From what little information you have already given I think you are right to be concerned about Walker. I am worried that he might already be on too high a dose of insulin. I would be very worried about increasing his dose again. Too much insulin can look like too little insulin because the liver works overtime to release glucose into the bloodstream to compensate for the excessive amount of 'foreign' insulin being injected into the body. Adding more insulin to an already too-high dose will just keep driving numbers up or, worse, could trigger a hypo episode. I'm particularly concerned about your vet's instruction to give 4 units of insulin at night because many cats' blood glucose levels go lower at night. If it was my cat, I would not increase the dose till I knew exactly what was going on with my cat's blood glucose levels.

    Your description of Walker's hiding behaviour could be his way of letting you know that the insulin is making him feel lousy. (For information, my Saoirse started behaving very similarly when she was being treated with Caninsulin, another quite harsh insulin. She did much better and was much happier and healthier when on Lantus.) This could either be due to him being constantly in high numbers or else possibly his blood glucose levels being on a bit of a rollercoaster due to the insulin. (Need more data to determine what's actually happening.)

    History:

    We don't have much in the way of data from you yet. Could you answer some questions for us, please?

    - What was the starting dose of Novolin N and how did Walker behave at that dose? What were his BG numbers like then?

    - By how much did your vet increase the dose and when? What changes did you notice in Walker (playfulness, alertness, how much he was eating, drinking and peeing)?

    - What dose was he on when he was more playful and energetic? What were his numbers like then?

    Food:
    Is it Fancy Feast Mixed Grill that you're feeding? Also, is the Royal Canin Urinary s/o the dry food or the canned?

    Whatever you do, until such time as Walker's insulin dosing is sorted out DO NOT CHANGE HIS DIET UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. The dose needs to be sorted out urgently.

    Since Walker is underweight at the moment and he's at high numbers he's not able to use the nutrients in the food he's eating properly. He needs extra food. While you're sorting out Walker's proper insulin needs I would recommend in the strongest terms that you leave food out for him at all times, doubly so while there is a question mark over whether he's getting too much insulin at the moment.



    Mogs
    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2015
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  10. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    Me again!

    Do you keep a written log of Walker's blood glucose test data? It would be very helpful if you could set up one of our spreadsheets to record and track his data. You'll be able to share the spreadsheet with members here and they'll get a better picture of what's happening with him and therefore be able to make better suggestions should you need help. Here is a link to tell you how to set up a spreadsheet. If you get stuck, we can find someone to help you with set-up.

    How to Set Up a Spreadsheet and Link it to Your FDMB Forum Signature

    Key to Spreadsheet:

    AMPS = Morning pre-shot test taken before giving food and insulin.
    PMPS = Evening pre-shot test taken before giving food and insulin

    U = Units of Insulin dosed
    +1, +2, +3, etc. = number of hours elapsed between time of insulin injection and time of test. (e.g. a test taken 3 hours after the morning dose would be recorded the AM +3 column; a test taken 4 hours after evening dose would be in PM+4 column).

    Recording details of mealtimes and amounts fed plus any important clinical signs (like playing, energy levels, etc.) in the Remarks column is very helpful. Have a look at the spreadsheet links in other members' signatures to get the idea.


    Mogs
    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2015
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  11. ctmorris

    ctmorris Member

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    Aug 25, 2015
    Hey - I have a spreadsheet I recently put together for my kitty Lucky - if you load in your kitty's readings in the Glucose Readings tab you'll get a graph on the chart tab. I created a couple other sheets to try to record the response and get a picture of that for both the morning and night shots. My kitty is on Lantus. With a shorter / faster acting insulin you should probably test more frequently so that you know where the moderation is. If your vet isn't interested in talking to you about all the options I'd honestly seek another vet. But that is just me. If you shoot me your email I can send the spreadsheet to you if you want.
     
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  12. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    With such high home #'s, those #'s concern me. But you need to test more during the day and at the Nadir (the lowest point). Please see my link to BJM's recommendations for testing in my 6th post above.

    I can't tell what dose is right or not but I can tell you the Novolin isn't working a full 12 hours for Walker. It wears off long before and explains why Walker isn't a happy camper.

    CJ had lower #'s than Walker. She started out on 2 units and then 2.5 units and then went hypo.

    Hopefully some veteran members will check in soon and better advise as to whether that 3 or 4 units of Novolin is too high or not. It does sound like Walker needs to be on a different insulin unless you're able to give Novolin every 8 hours, something few caretakers wish to do.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2015
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  13. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Thank you guys so much for all the info. I am at work but will put all the info I have on a spreadsheet as I would so love the help. I did go home at lunch to see how he was doing. Normally he gets up to greet me when I come home but he didn't. Found him sleeping in my office and he was just so tired. I checked his BG and it was down to 440. Oddly he was acting the most normal and energetic I have seen him act in awhile which was this morning when he was at 592.

    RE: food changing, I am currently giving him Fancy Feast Grilled. Would it be too big of a change to switch it to Fancy Feast Classics which is what is recommended here?
     
  14. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    @Critter Mom why do you suggest not changing the diet yet? I think transitioning Walker slowly to a low carb diet would be wise and help get those high #'s lower.

    Fancy Feast Classics is a good low carb choice.
     
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  15. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    @Cat Ma -

    Numbers appear to be being driven upwards by the increase in dose, not downwards.

    If the dose is too high reducing the current carb load could be dangerous (especially with a harsh insulin). The dose needs to be sorted out first. The diet transition can wait. Marathon, not sprint.
    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2015
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  16. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    Good explanation about how too much insulin can look like too little insulin, @Critter Mom

    Walker's Mom should check for ketones. I suggest getting ketones strips and testing when you get home. You can pick up the strips at Walmart.
     
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  17. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    What do I do if he has ketones?
     
  18. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    If the result is 'Trace' then monitor frequently. Anything more than trace requires an immediate trip to the vets. Cats producing ketones are at risk of developing diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). It is a potentially life-threatening complication of diabetes that requires veterinary intervention. It's miserable for the cat, and it's expensive to treat.
     
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  19. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    There are different tips for catching the urine and then testing it on a ketones strip. Some stick a strip under the cat as the cat pees. Most cats don't like us watching them doing their business but have you ever seen a cat hold its pee when it starts to go? Others use foil or aquarium gravel. Timing is important. You need a fresh sample.

    See Secondary Monitoring Tools in BJM's signature line above and then click on Urine Testing. She offers some good suggestions.
     
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  20. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    BTW, are you guys using an AlphaTrak? That is the one the vet has me using. Just want to make sure that I am reading his blood sugar accurately.
     
  21. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Also, is there a best way to administer insulin? I have been pulling up his scruff and injecting. Just want to make sure I am doing that correctly too.
     
  22. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Most members here use human glucometers with a cat-specific reference range. Others, myself included, use Alphatrak meters. I've been using mine for over a year now, and I'm very pleased with it. Human meter test strips are significantly cheaper than Alphatrak ones, but I like that fact that it is calibrated for use on cats: I've got a lot of anxiety problems and knowing it's pet-specific gives me a peace of mind that I value more than I would a large lottery win. For information, human meters have been scientifically proven to be effective tools for feline blood glucose measurement.


    Mogs
    .
     
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  23. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    No, I use a Relion Micro meter from Walmart because I can get the strips cheaply and conveniently.

    See BJM's glucometer chart. The first # is the human meter #, the 3rd # in curly brackets are for AlphaTrak: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oI_34_EgqeKdpyttFW0oLoG1mbw16IkATAWHhoQD2JU/pub

    Alpha Trak is fine but you'll be paying more for strips. That's why many Alpha Trak users end up buying the Relion meters and strips. The meters are under $15, the strips are about $35 for 100.
     
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  24. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    That is the correct way. You can also inject anywhere you can pull up fur. When I was giving CJ insulin, I rotated places i.e. right side of nape in the am and left side in the evening. Sometimes I injected in her flank.
     
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  25. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Mogs, I'm with you. I like that it is cat specific. Where do you get your Alpha Trak test strips? I realized I am running out and I was curious where is the cheapest place to get them?
     
  26. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Did you have to do something special to the Relion Micro meter so that it calibrates for your kitty? How does that work using a human glucometer for a cat?
     
  27. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    I have checked Walker 2x 3.5 hours after feeding. His numbers were 440 and 446.
     
  28. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    His blood glucose is dropping to around 440 3.5 hours after he has eaten. I'm not sure what that tells me about the higher numbers. I sincerely appreciate all your help!
     
  29. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    We use feline specific reference numbers for human glucometers.
    Specific insulin protocols will recommend numbers to stay above and pre-shot numbers that should be high enough, for the safety of your cat.
     
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  30. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    Nope. I just follow BJM's wonderful Glucomter Notes in her signature line above. No conversion is needed.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2015
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  31. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    It sounds like Novolin is doing as it should, working up to 8 hours or so. Walker isn't getting 12 hours of insulin. If you want optimal benefit, you'd need to give him Novolin every 8 hours. Few people care to do that.

    @BJM Should Walker ride out the Novolin first on the dose he's on or slowly transition to a low carb diet and a lower or the same Novolin dose?
     
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  32. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    @Walker's Mom Please see Critter Mom's 10th post for how to set up a spread sheet. It will help us help you more easily. If you need help, just ask.

    It will also help us help you if you add info to your signature line. Click on your profile/name, then click on signature and add the following:
    Date diagnosed, insulin using, dose, food feeding, any other medical conditions if applicable and then click save.
     
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  33. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    It seems like there is a wide range when comparing the human glucometer with the AlphaTrak. Am I reading the notes correctly?
     
  34. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    FYI, today his numbers started to come down. I know it was suggested I not change his diet until I got his BG regulated with insulin but his BG was getting so crazy high I had to do something. I did remove the dry food that I normally leave out (Royal Canin SO) yesterday since his before dinner BG was 677. According to the vet I was not at risk at going hypo while he is that high. I only left the SO out because (1. he had a UTI issue in April &
    2. I wanted to make sure he had something to eat while I was at work in case he went hypo). Thank you for letting me know it was bad for sugarcats.

    Since I am home this weekend to watch him/measure his afternoon BG, I decided to remove that food from his normal routine. I took him to the vet today to check his BG to make sure they were getting the same numbers. His BG has dropped to 384 (four hours after insulin injection). I also had them check him for ketones. They said he didn't have any. Yeah!! Thank you so much for telling me to check for them!!

    Currently the vet has me on 3 units in the morning and 4 at night. The feeding plan now is to keep him on his FF Grilled (which he likes and eats) and add a little canned DM to make up for the dry food calories he is not getting and add a little more protein to the diet. Don't want to change his diet too much until I know how he is going to do on the insulin and don't want to upset his tummy and he not eat.

    There are multiple vets where I go. The vet I met with today wanted to stick with the Novelin N for now and see how the numbers do over the next week at the new dose and see where he levels out. I feel like they won't consider another insulin until we have given Novelin a "fair shot." I get the impression that he might consider changing if we can't get him leveled out in the next week or so.

    I so appreciate your help and input. This has really been stressful and I am grateful for y'alls wisdom and expertise.
     
  35. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    I added as you suggested. Thanks for letting me know where to post.
     
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  36. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    RE: spreadsheet, I went to download it and when I previewed it, I found it sort of overwhelming. Is there a simpler one?
     
  37. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    Welcome Walker's Mom! We all know how stressful it is with our sugar cats and especially in the beginning. You are in good company and the experienced ones and awesome. See you around the forum. The spreadsheet will get easier to navigate.
     
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  38. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    It's very hard to get a cat regulated on Novolin. I have yet to read of one that has been. With Novolin, anything is possible. With higher doses and a change in diet, a cat can very well go hypo at any time on Novolin. That's why home monitoring, which you are doing now, is so crucial.

    Good that you're doing the diet change very slowly because your vet had you increase the Novolin. While it is comforting seeing lower numbers, you want to make changes slowly. I am not clear why he wants you to give 3 units in the morning and 4 units at night. Usually we stick to the same dose for morning and evening. 3 and 4 units are quite high.

    The 384 BG # was at the vet, right? If so, the home numbers will likely be much lower, especially if Walker was stressed at the vet. Let us know what his home #'s are when you test again.

    Already, you're seeing a drop in BG #'s and hopefully it will continue to stay that way. It's hard to know with Novolin because it's so short acting and can be unpredictable. If you see very high numbers and then low number, that means Walker is bouncing and that's to be expected with Novolin. Bouncing is hard on a cat. This may or may not happen with Walker.

    Be prepared if the #'s go too low, under . Again, be sure to have honey, karo syrup or high carb gravy food on hand in case of a hypo episode. We'll happily guide you through a hypo episode so you don't have to spend needless money and time plus stress at the vet or ER. Terrific people here guided me when CJ went hypo on Novolin. If Walker goes under 50 68 on the Alpha Trak, add a 911 to the prefix in a new thread and you'll get lots of wonderful people to guide you.

    Great news about no ketones! Do buy some ketones strips at Walmart and test at home when the numbers are still high. Plus, you can spare yourself money and time having it tested at the vet.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2015
  39. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    I am not sure. By the time I tried to figure out how to set it up, CJ went into remission. We have terrific members who can help you with this. I'd suggest posting a new thread in the tech forum for help in setting up your spreadsheet. That will get more notice and help from members:

    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/suggestions-tech-support-testing-area.6/
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2015
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  40. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

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    May 21, 2015
    Good job on adding the info to your signature line! I'd suggest you change it to read that you want him stabilized before I change his diet to more protein low carbs. Focus on low carbs, not more protein.

    Dental cleanings are a must with sugar cats. Infections can raise BG #'s so close monitoring of teeth is necessary.
     
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  41. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    Oct 6, 2010
    I don't understand what you are asking.

    As numbers get higher, the width in mg/dL of the allowable error (the +/- 20% allowed by the FDA) increases, too.
    So,
    100 -> 80 to 120, a width of 40 mg/dL
    200 -> 160 - 240, a width of 80 mg/dL
    300 -> 240 - 360, a width of 120 mg/dL

    We're most concerned about the low numbers, due to concerns over hypoglycemia.
    While high numbers aren't great, we are most concerned about higher numbers when there are ketones, lack of appetite, lethargy, or other signs of illness.
     
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  42. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Thank you Bobbie and Bubba! It is so nice to be around people who understand the stress. :)
     
  43. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    So if your human glucometer says 100, it could actually be anywhere between 80 & 120 on an AlphaTrak. Correct? And if that is the case, 120 would be OK BG but 80 is too low, correct? Or is 80 and OK number for a cat?
     
  44. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Good point! Will change. Regarding teeth, what is the safe way to clean sugarcats? My kitty is 10 years old and with all his current health issues I'm concerned about putting him under anesthesia.
     
  45. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    Oct 6, 2010
    No, that isn't what I'm saying.
    We do NOT convert between the meter types.
    On the average, a human meter may read 30-40% lower than a pet meter. Without tons of test data, there is no formula, nor function to do that reliably.


    For a cat on insulin, using a human meter, normal numbers are between 50-130 mg/dL.
     
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  46. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

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    Aug 27, 2015
    Oh, that is helpful!!! So normal range for kitty is between 50-130 and the goal is to get to that range. That is simple. I like simple. :) My brain is currently on overload and that helps a bunch!!
     
  47. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    Oct 6, 2010
    You want to aim for on a human meter, but go gradually and methodically. Dose adjustments are made based on the nadir - the lowest glucose post-shot.

    Many cats go lower at night, so it seems a bit backwards to have the higher dose at night.
     
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  48. granadilla

    granadilla Well-Known Member

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    Jun 13, 2015
    Quick note: the range of 50-130 is on a human meter. If you're still using an Alphtrak, the hypo number is 68 or lower. So if he goes lower than 69, post a message on the main health forum with the prefix 911 asking for help and people can help guide you to getting back above 68.
     
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  49. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    His numbers in the morning have been in the high 500s which is why the vet went to 4 units at night.
     
  50. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Thank you for letting me know that! The only thing I know to do is rub honey on his gums to get him to eat the sugar. Are there other things that I would do?
     
  51. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    You would need to test every 30 minutes and keep giving honey till the BG #'s go up, past the hypo #'s (thank you, @granadilla for pointing out the AlphaTrak hypo #).

    If Walker does go hypo, post in The Main Forum so more members will see your post and be able to guide you.

    If you need the link to The Main Forum, let us know.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2015
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  52. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Many sugar cats have had dental cleanings under anesthesia successfully. A 19 year old sugar cat here had a cleaning in April. You'd want to discuss with your vet when a cleaning should be done. Current blood work and an exam are necessary prior to a dental cleaning. There is no way to do a successful, thorough dental cleaning (and extractions, if needed) without anesthesia. There are many good discussions on dental cleanings in the forum. You can type in the word dental in the Search Box in the upper right hand corner at the top of the page. Or you can start a new thread in the Main Forum.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2015
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  53. Shiloh & Rhonda (GA)

    Shiloh & Rhonda (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2015
    @Walker's Mom , if you will send me your email address in a private message, I can set up the spreadsheet for you.
     
  54. Walker's Mom

    Walker's Mom Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    How do I send a private message?
     
  55. Shiloh & Rhonda (GA)

    Shiloh & Rhonda (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2015
    Click on my name. My profile picture will pop up and there is a link that says start a conversation.

    @Critter Mom , cross post!
     
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  56. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    That may be because he is going too low and then bouncing up to compensate, plus, because in is Novolin NPH, that wears off after 8-10 hours. Giving more risks a hypoglycemic attack.
    It'll be rough, but set the clock to get up about +3 or +4 hours after the evening shot to test him to see how low he is going, for his safety.
     
  57. Hagin's mom

    Hagin's mom New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    sorry, I canon future out how to post a new thread -- new to the site:

    Subject: Hills Metabolic + Urinary canned food

    Hello --

    My 10-11 year old boy was diagnosed with diabetes less than two weeks ago. We'd been feeding him Hills Prescription c/d for 8 years since he had a blocked bladder and emergency surgery in 2007 when he was about 2.

    I am sad to only be researching cat feeding now, but am convinced that he became moderately overweight and now diabetic because of a very high-carb diet (almost 45%) for almost his whole live. Now my vet tells me to switch to Hills Metabolic + Urinary canned food, which is pretty much prohibitively expensive, tho I did buy 24 of the 2.9 ox cans for $40!!!! (at one can per feeding -- 12 days!)

    I wrote a letter to the company, basically questioning whether his diabetes is a result of eating their food his entire life….Of course, they are very concerned about his health and have a 100% refund policy (what? for 8 years???) Oh, and they are going to send me some coupons…

    Two questions: is it true when they tell me that the "dry matter" % of the metabolic + urinary is only 6.0%?? Also, can I switch him to some other low-carb food without harming him now that he is on 1.5 units of insulin twice a day? I have not started home testing -- he just had a glucose curve done for the first time yesterday, after the first week of insulin shorts (he was at 2 units twice a day, but now we are lowering it). So he is doing fine, as far as I am told.

    Help?
     
  58. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    Welcome! Your kitty is adorable! To post a new thread, look at the top right hand corner. You'll see a blue box marked 'post new thread'. Click on it and a box should come up for you to write your questions in. I'm new here and can't answer all your questions, but I would think that switching to a low carb canned food would be fine, but you must start home testing first! When you switch to the low carb food, blood glucose level can drop significantly and you risk your kitty's going hypo,which is life threatening. You can get any human meter to test. As far as which food to switch to, does your cat have any other problems? Since your vet wants you on metabolic + urinary food does that mean he still has problems with blockages? My cat did when he was young too and was on the c/d, but was weaned off it within a year. He's been on regular food up until the diabetes diagnosis and is now on strictly canned food-Fancy Feast. Please get the meter & begin testing as soon as you can. The people here will help you with any questions you have-they have really helped me! Again welcome!
     
  59. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    See Cat Info for feline nutrition info on several prescription diets.
     
  60. Cat Ma

    Cat Ma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
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